Zorn Makes Great Progress with New Offense Geared To Campbells Talents

[Beemnseven]

Randy Cross, who played for Bill Walsh once said that nobody is really playing the true West Coast offense anymore.

I think the closest thing to the original was Mike Holmgren's offense. Even then though, Montana and Favre both threw bombs downfield.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

Randy Cross, who played for Bill Walsh once said that nobody is really playing the true West Coast offense anymore.

I think the closest thing to the original was Mike Holmgren's offense. Even then though, Montana and Favre both threw bombs downfield.

Thank you!

Somehow the WCO has gotten the false reputation for being short pass only. Some people think that the WCO and a vertical passing game are opposites. The fact is, although the WCO stresses short passes, there always has been a vertical component. The vertical game is there for its own sake and also to open up space for shorter routes. Anyone who remembers Jerry Rice and John Taylor racing past defenders on go routes knows this.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Lotus

Thank you!

Somehow the WCO has gotten the false reputation for being short pass only. Some people think that the WCO and a vertical passing game are opposites. The fact is, although the WCO stresses short passes, there always has been a vertical component. The vertical game is there for its own sake and also to open up space for shorter routes. Anyone who remembers Jerry Rice and John Taylor racing past defenders on go routes knows this.

Zorn also relies on the vertical routes more than most coaches to open up the underneath. Other WCO versions sometimes like to use the backs on swing passes to open up the middle of the field for the receivers, but Zorn prefers to run 'em off.

[NYCskinfan82]

Originally Posted by Lotus

Thank you!

Somehow the WCO has gotten the false reputation for being short pass only. Some people think that the WCO and a vertical passing game are opposites. The fact is, although the WCO stresses short passes, there always has been a vertical component. The vertical game is there for its own sake and also to open up space for shorter routes. Anyone who remembers Jerry Rice and John Taylor racing past defenders on go routes knows this.

That's right tell them my brother.

[Mechanix544]

To make it short and sweet - If J.C. and Zorn do not AT LEAST double the amount of passing plays that went for over 20 yards last year, Portis will have under 4.0 ypc and you will see frustration set in by week 6. Gotta open the field up fellas, gotta.

[53Fan]

Originally Posted by Lotus

Thank you!

Somehow the WCO has gotten the false reputation for being short pass only. Some people think that the WCO and a vertical passing game are opposites. The fact is, although the WCO stresses short passes, there always has been a vertical component. The vertical game is there for its own sake and also to open up space for shorter routes. Anyone who remembers Jerry Rice and John Taylor racing past defenders on go routes knows this.

Exactly. We just weren't prepared for that part of the offense yet. O-line injuries, rookie receivers who weren't ready, trying to get the limited plays we did have run well etc. Now we are.

[SirClintonPortis]

Bill Walsh himself recognized the value of play action and 7-step drop plays and their usefulness in nabbing TDs.

Also, he WCO was born out of necessity to accomodate to his QBs' strengths way back when injury took out his original starter and he was left with noodle-armed Virgil Carter, so Zorn accomodating the offense to his QB's, JC strengths(big arm, better on longer passes than shorter ones) etc is NOT something that is 'forbbiden' in the WCO coaching tree.

Of course, going deep requires talented deep threats, of which we only had one in Santana Moss, and good pass pro. ARE(slot receiver) and James Thrash(special teamer) simply did not scare defenses enough to pull defenders away from Moss and Cooley is obviously more of a possession guy.

[T.O.Killa]

Dont forget, I started this pro Campbell thread.

[T.O.Killa]

I was listening to Phil Simms on Washington Post live. He sad that he thought that Jim Zorn has changed his offense to suit JC needs. He also said that he said we could be a very good team.

[skinsnut]

The West Coast system is essentially throwing for 3 yards instead of running for 3...all that other crap is irrelevant...such as throwing bombs...that is all part of any system.
It's just how deep passes are done.

The odd part is we have Portis, so technically, there is no real reason to run a west coast system here since we have the abiility to run for 3 consistantly...and when you have that ability, you can run play action effectively...which is typically rare in WC systems....because, WC passes for short yardage and don't run.

If we can do both, we will be in very good shape, but, as someone else has mentioned, there is no real substantial change in our offense other than more experience...unless a rookie wideout suddenly becomes highly productive.

This offense will have to prove it for me to believe we can open it up.
I was impressed in a few deep balls in the last couple preseason games...but those are no risk games. Lets wait and see what Zorn calls in live games.

Also, I saw VERY LITTLE misdirection in the offense in preseason, very few screens...which match our very quick WRs, no reverses. No motion, pitches were rare, no shovel passes. The problem last year was a predictable offense. If you cant throw deep effectively, you still have all these tools to use to keep a defense off of Portis. Zorn didn't use them, and he certainly didn't practice this offseason.
If you don't practice something, you cannot execute it.

So my fear is this....our offense will be very basic again with no creativity.
It will essentially come down to execution.
Misdirection covers a multitude of execution deficiencies.
Zorn hasn't figured that out yet.

Will he have Campbell throw deep?
He better...it is the only hope to get some freedom for Portis because Zorn aint gunna do anything creative on offense

[CRedskinsRule]

skinsnut, you are gonna be surprised tomorrow, I promise you that. Last year Zorn focused on implementing the basics, that is pretty common practice for teaching. He has to trust everyone is on the same page. This year will be different, he said as much over and over. I suppose they could prove me wrong, but I think the players and coaches know what we don't. I think Zorn and the offense will be very creative, and just cause we didn't see it in preseason, doesn't mean they didn't practice it. Now I am not calling for a Saunderesque playbook, but he will be very aggressive.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by skinsnut

The West Coast system is essentially throwing for 3 yards instead of running for 3...all that other crap is irrelevant...such as throwing bombs...that is all part of any system.
It's just how deep passes are done.

The odd part is we have Portis, so technically, there is no real reason to run a west coast system here since we have the abiility to run for 3 consistantly...and when you have that ability, you can run play action effectively...which is typically rare in WC systems....because, WC passes for short yardage and don't run.

If we can do both, we will be in very good shape, but, as someone else has mentioned, there is no real substantial change in our offense other than more experience...unless a rookie wideout suddenly becomes highly productive.

This offense will have to prove it for me to believe we can open it up.
I was impressed in a few deep balls in the last couple preseason games...but those are no risk games. Lets wait and see what Zorn calls in live games.

Also, I saw VERY LITTLE misdirection in the offense in preseason, very few screens...which match our very quick WRs, no reverses. No motion, pitches were rare, no shovel passes. The problem last year was a predictable offense. If you cant throw deep effectively, you still have all these tools to use to keep a defense off of Portis. Zorn didn't use them, and he certainly didn't practice this offseason.
If you don't practice something, you cannot execute it.

So my fear is this....our offense will be very basic again with no creativity.
It will essentially come down to execution.
Misdirection covers a multitude of execution deficiencies.
Zorn hasn't figured that out yet.

Will he have Campbell throw deep?
He better...it is the only hope to get some freedom for Portis because Zorn aint gunna do anything creative on offense

Your concerns about misdirection may be well-founded.

Then again, you are not going to show your tricks in open practices or preseason games. We might see plenty of misdirection starting Sunday.

[CRedskinsRule]

do we ever see ARE run an option in pre season? I doubt it. In fact the iggles showed lots of stuff with Vick, and all that meant is they weren't "getting into a rhythm" and gelling on the basics. I doubt the Patriots or Colts ran many trick plays either. Pre-season is for getting out there knocking the rust off and coming together as a unit. The trick plays or special plays will come, I am sure of that. (Hopefully not a TE reverse at the 50 though)

[Njall]

Moss and Randel El got to go their time is up. Scrap the Offense and buid it up around a new QB. Skin's go 8-8 again this year. Even if we had River's or Payton Manning they will achive nothing with these 2 number 3 receivers .

[Trample the Elderly]

Show me!