Offer made on Chad (1st rd '08, conditional 3rd rd '09)

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

Wow. Those figures scream out for an infusion of youth especially at O-line. Sooner or later the front five will start dropping like flies. Well ... that actually already happened last season for a stretch. We have to start bolstering a restocking for the future. And we have to start now.

I agree. I'd really like to see us use at least 2 picks along the OL in this draft.

Hell I wouldn't even hate the idea of using a 2nd rounder. And then maybe a later round project type of pick.

[Dirtbag59]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

I agree. I'd really like to see us use at least 2 picks along the OL in this draft.

Hell I wouldn't even hate the idea of using a 2nd rounder. And then maybe a later round project type of pick.

I predict an 80% chance that the team takes two O-lineman if they wait till the 3rd-comp pick to take an Offensive Lineman. I say this because the team has a history of taking two guys at the same position late when they have a need that wasn't addressed earlier in the draft. (Montgomery and Kedric Golston/ Dallas Startz and HB Blades/ Jim Molinaro and Mark Wilson). Of course most of these were 5th round/6th round combinations where as this year I would expect to see a 3rd/5th combo

[Larry Michael is Satan]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

He was too busy smoking crack or something.

Ocho Cinco and his agent be the ones busy smokin crack!

Sorry, but my fundamental aversion to Chad Johnson is that he is not a "Redskin" and we have other needs to address with our draft picks. We have plenty of vets at WR, I'd like to have a young, hungry one in there that we can think long long term with. If he was on the Skins and he was acting like he is now, disrespecting his team and coach, it would be embarrassing, and Snyder would send him off to Laveranues Lavar Land. Also, ....the huge contract, ...we need to look to the future. Just my opinion.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by riggoraider

What gets me is that when we are discussing players like Jason Campbell, whom we love, the main point is, "he is still young" and "we should give him a chance to grow", when he will be 27 at the end of the year but when we discuss players who's only a few year older who we may not want, like Chad Johnson, the age suddenly becomes a problem .

It is like a NFL player only have three years between growing and becoming too old to play at certain level.

IMO, there is a world of a difference between a 26 year old and a 30 year old. Four years is an awful long time in terms of a football career. Four years ago: Spurrier had just left the building, Trung Canidate was on the roster, Patrick Ramsey was competing for the starting QB role, Bruce Smith had just broken the sack record, Sean Taylor wasn't on the roster, Laron Landry was a freshman in college and Jon Jansen was one of the most dominant right tackles in football. The following players were coming off of Pro Bowl berths: Steve McNair, Stephen Davis, Priest Holmes, Fred Beasley, Keenan McCardell, Dexter Coakley, Peter Boulware, Troy Vincent, Jerry Azumah, Brock Marion, Aeneas Williams, Jerome Woods. A lot happens in 4 years.

At 26, a wideout is on the cusp of entering the prime of his career. At 30, a wideout is about to see his skills erode. Would you buy a stock if you knew it's value would only decrease over the coming years? If not, why would you trade for a player who is at the apex of his career and is only going to decrease in value?

[djnemo65]

I know Matty and others have mentioned this before, but Urlacher is really amping up his demands, promising to boycott minicamp if not given a new contract, in spite of signing a deal only 3 or so years ago making him one of the highest paid LB's in football. And yet there have been no character assaults or derogatory nicknames directed toward him.

Not enough people point out that the Bengals have squandered a Superbowl roster in only 3 short years, and are inarguably one of the worst run teams in football. Why can't Chad's trade requests be related to him wanting to win?

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

Larry Michael is Satan:

I agree we shouldn't make the trade, but I think you're overstating your case. Chad Johnson has put up good numbers with a variety of QBs under center not named Carson Palmer. Chad is no Jerry Rice, but he's certainly among the best and most productive wideouts who are currently playing ball. As for our o-line, barring injury, we're in pretty good shape for 2008.

And you just said the magic words. Barring injury!! What are the chances of Kendall playing 16 games on crappy knees? Also we can't expect Jansen to play at the level he did a few years ago. He's missed 2 out of the last 4 seasons. So Heyer or someone else needs to be ready. Also Thomas has missed time 2/4 years and when he's out it really seems to hurt the line. Badly. And I'd hate to even think what would happen if Samuels went down. So IMO we have got to stop chasing expensive FA's and start building quality depth.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

A lot of players hold out for better deals and, provided they are not Redskins, I don't really care. What kills me is how Chad is the consummate "Leon Budweiser" receiver that represents everything that is wrong with football. On several occasions Chad Johnson drew personal fouls for excessive celebration, despite knowing such celebrations would cost his team field position. Chad often planned those celebrations well in advance, knowing full well that he would draw those little yellow flags. To draw a flag is forgiveable. To repeatedly plan celebrations that will undoubtedly hurt the team is inexcusable in my book.

[WaldSkins]

Just saw on ESPNews that we were denied by the cardinals for a possible Boldin trade. Same picks were offered as in the CJ deal.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

A lot of players hold out for better deals and, provided they are not Redskins, I don't really care. What kills me is how Chad is the consummate "Leon Budweiser" receiver that represents everything that is wrong with football. On several occasions Chad Johnson drew personal fouls for excessive celebration, despite knowing such celebrations would cost his team field position. Chad often planned those celebrations well in advance, knowing full well that he would draw those little yellow flags. To draw a flag is forgiveable. To repeatedly plan celebrations that will undoubtedly hurt the team is inexcusable in my book.

But he produces...consistently. And he's often the first one to practice, and the last one out. And, fair or not, he's an effing saint compared to many of his teammates. What he's done to "hurt" his team shouldn't negate all he's done to help his team and it's far less egregious than what many of his own teammates have done.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

But he produces...consistently. And he's often the first one to practice, and the last one out. And, fair or not, he's an effing saint compared to many of his teammates. What he's done to "hurt" his team shouldn't negate all he's done to help his team and it's far less egregious than what many of his own teammates have done.

I can't deny that he has immense talent, has a great work ethic, and produces. I remember reading quotes from various Bengals players and coaches a few years back and, to a man, they all said Chad works his ass off.

And Chad is certainly no Pacman. I've never heard of Chad getting into any trouble with the law. But, while Chad is not in the class of Pacman-esque turds, he is in the class of T.O. turds. I simply don't like the guy and, admittedly, I'm probably allowing that bias to color my view of the trade talks.

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Are you more upset that it's a trade for Chad Johnson or a trade of the pick?



What Cerrato had said from the start was that they didn't expect to be big players in free agency this year (which we weren't) but that he is always looking for ways to improve the team and would entertain trade possibilities if he feels it would improve the team.



It ain't braggin' if you can back it up



I've said this before but I'll say it again. Why don't we even remotely consider that Zorn is very familiar with Hackett, and that's why we didn't sign him. That maybe, jussssst maybe, Zorn said "Hey, this guy has potential and can contribute but I've been around him every day for the past several years and keep this, this, that, and that in mind. And this is how I see him fitting in and this is what he's worth." (and it's not as much as the fans think)

To answer your question- I'm more upset it's a proposed trade of draft picks than I am that it's a trade for Chad. CJ is awesome. But trading our draft picks has not panned out for us in the past.

I understand trading for CJ would improve the team on paper. But again, I worry about bringing a mouth like his into an already united locker room with a rookie head coach. Not to mention we're giving up a significant amount in both this and next year's draft to do so. I know he's awesome, but it just worries me.

You bring up a good point about Hackett. Surely Zorn has inside info on him and maybe he's not worth the cash. I just think there are other routes we can take to bring in a big WR without trading high draft picks and signing a 30 year old guy with some baggage. Don't get me wrong, I think Ocho is a hell of a player, I'm just torn about acquiring him for multiple reasons.

[HOGTIMUS PRIME]

Originally Posted by Skinny Tee

Thank God that the Bengals can save us from ourselves.

How dopey is it to come this far with all your picks just to hand them out at the last second. So much for draft disicipline.

This annoys me and doesn't bode well for who they think is going to be available with the 21st pick in the draft. One week before the draft they want to heave their draft stratedy out the window, I'm annoyed.

Got that right!

The inability of who ever is drafting to identify unproven talent leads to over spending, and over compensating for established players, it seems we really never learn our lesson? Let's bring in a ME player, lets make him happy with a brand new contract, and by the way lets give up what could be 2 #1's in the process to a team that he has already basically pigeon holed into having to deal him! I guess we have to sign a WR every year or we can't sleep at night. To all who thought we may have turned the corner as far as our approach to building a team with the draft? Happy belated April fools.

By the way lets see how much everyone loves him here in DC when he starts running his mouth about how he's not seeing the ball? He has a top flight QB in cinnci, does anyone believe Campbell is going to make this clown happy? I don't see it. I have to say Cinnci is crazy not to make that deal, perhaps we have found a team who's personnel dept is actually dumber than ours?

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by HOGTIMUS PRIME

Got that right!

The inability of who ever is drafting to identify unproven talent leads to over spending, and over compensating for established players, it seems we really never learn our lesson? Let's bring in a ME player, lets make him happy with a brand new contract, and by the way lets give up what could be 2 #1's in the process to a team that he has already basically pigeon holed into having to deal him! I guess we have to sign a WR every year or we can't sleep at night. To all who thought we may have turned the corner as far as our approach to building a team with the draft? Happy belated April fools.

By the way lets see how much everyone loves him here in DC when he starts running his mouth about how he's not seeing the ball? He has a top flight QB in cinnci, does anyone believe Campbell is going to make this clown happy? I don't see it. I have to say Cinnci is crazy not to make that deal, perhaps we have found a team who's personnel dept is actually dumber than ours?

1. We're talking about trading one pick this year for one of the game's most talented WRs

2. We are not throwing all our picks away

3. Why is it not even remotely considered that maybe, just maybe, Chad Johnson will help Jason Campbell get to that next level. That maybe, just maybe, a stud receiver like Chad Johnson would be the best thing to happen to Campbell?

4. Too many people have way too narrow an understanding of how to build a team

[The Goat]

I'm less and less excited about CJ or any other vet WR coming to town as part of a big trade. There are 5 1st round quality OTs in the draft with another 2 inside o-lineman and another 4 top tier DTs. Last year proved beyond any reasonable doubt we need young talent at these positions and it's very hard to believe all of the top guys will be gone by the 21st pick. CJ carries a huge risk factor because of his personality w/ the loss of picks we desperately need. For instance, when (not if) our current stock of lineman become injured during the season the downside is huge. Meanwhile, the upside to CJ is questionable and we know exactly what we're giving up: young talent where we need it.

[The Goat]

The other thing I keep thinking is that w/ quality reinforcement on the line we can let Cooley get out and make plays. It's like killing two birds w/ one stone: a better, younger line and a better passing game. Otherwise, we pass on strengthening the line and put all hope in a WR that may or may not pan out.

I'm also worried about CJ working w/ JC. He's gotten spoiled from Palmer, an elite passer, throwing him perfect bombs. I'd be very concerned that JC's accuracy issues would become a source of contention and drama.