Big Ben off the hook again.

[TheBackupKicker]

i was just on the steelers board talkin shit about the pens and big ben

[Pocket$ $traight]

Originally Posted by DCSportsFan98

pockets straight your taking that innocent until proven guilty thing too far

would you let your daughter hang out with this guy?

If I have said it once, I have said it a thousand times. The Bill of Rights is overrated!!! ;-)

If I had a daughter I would implant a GPS in her...

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by DCSportsFan98

pockets straight your taking that innocent until proven guilty thing too far

would you let your daughter hang out with this guy?

Are you and BackUpKicker brothers or something like that?

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by DCSportsFan98

pockets straight your taking that innocent until proven guilty thing too far

would you let your daughter hang out with this guy?

Isn't that a different question than whether a guy is a "serial rapist"? Pocket Straight's point, i thing, and which I agree with, is it is one thing to say Ben's an idiot, and did idiotic things; and quite another to say that he is a serial rapist when he hasn't been convicted of even one. This doesn't seem like an unreasonable statement to me.

[Monkeydad]

I'm thinking pocket$ $traight's last name is Roethlisberger, he seems to want to be "that guy" that defends the guy no one else wants to.

[Pocket$ $traight]

Originally Posted by Buster

I'm thinking pocket$ $traight's last name is Roethlisberger, he seems to want to be "that guy" that defends the guy no one else wants to.

Check out the Big Ben thread when this first broke. I said, before any details came out, that my gut feeling was that he did something wrong.

I am not defending anything that Ben did. Maybe serial rapist is a label we can throw around at will now...

It wouldn't be the first or last time that I am wrong.

[Defensewins]

Serial Rapist?...Can't prove it.

Serial Immaturity..Yes

Serial Idiot...absolutely!

[Moondog]

There are lots of things we all "know" that we can't prove beyond a reasonable doubt.

We make decisions all the times based on this "knowledge". If we only made decisions based on what we could prove beyond a reasonable doubt we'd make a lot more mistakes.

What I "know" is this guy is a scumbag rapist.

Thankfully I don't need "beyond a reasonable doubt" to make every judgement for me. Common sense works much better.

And, yes, OJ did it.

[TheBackupKicker]

Originally Posted by Moondog

There are lots of things we all "know" that we can't prove beyond a reasonable doubt.

We make decisions all the times based on this "knowledge". If we only made decisions based on what we could prove beyond a reasonable doubt we'd make a lot more mistakes.

What I "know" is this guy is a scumbag rapist.

Thankfully I don't need "beyond a reasonable doubt" to make every judgement for me. Common sense works much better.

And, yes, OJ did it.

correct

[Moondog]

I'm not sure how I feel about someone, who wants to see us trade for BM, agreeing with me. :confused:

[Pocket$ $traight]

Originally Posted by Moondog

There are lots of things we all "know" that we can't prove beyond a reasonable doubt.

We make decisions all the times based on this "knowledge". If we only made decisions based on what we could prove beyond a reasonable doubt we'd make a lot more mistakes.

What I "know" is this guy is a scumbag rapist.

Thankfully I don't need "beyond a reasonable doubt" to make every judgement for me. Common sense works much better.

And, yes, OJ did it.

Let's hope you don't get accused of something and face 12 jurors like you. If you do, I will send you a toothbrush and some underwear.

[GMScud]

I had to LMAO at this one. PFT and Florio are a constant subject of criticism on this website. I read PFT a few times a week. Not because I like the site, but more because I like to scour for rumors and pick and choose what I think is plausible.

Florio had this preface to his post about Big Ben trade rumors:

It's one thing for the Internet to spawn sports rumors. Many of them come from message boards or slapdicks like me who throw stuff against the wall. Those rumors rarely register a blip.

HA! He flat out acknowledges what a hack he is. "Slapdicks like me..." "Those rumors rarely register a blip." LOL. At least Florio knows who he is.

Already, the Big Ben trade rumors start | ProFootballTalk.com

[Moondog]

Originally Posted by Pocket$ $traight

Let's hope you don't get accused of something and face 12 jurors like you. If you do, I will send you a toothbrush and some underwear.

You're missing the point.



Edit: What I am talking about is that we require different burdens of proof in different situations and contexts. And we all do this, including you, every day.


Looking at legal cases:

In criminal cases the burden of proof is beyond a reasonable doubt. This is the very highest burden of proof and it belongs here due to the life-long (or life-ending) consequences of the outcome.

In civil cases (the majority of legal cases people are asked to sit on juries for) the burden of proof is lower. Often simply a Preponderance of the Evidence or Clear and Convincing Evidence.

We do this in our everyday life as well. The more dangerous or risky a possible situation is, likely, the lower our burden of proof becomes before we decide it's a bad idea. For instance, based on Big Ben's history to date, no Child Placement Agency worth their salt is ever going to approve this dunderhead as a licensed foster or adoptive home for teenage girls.

Smoking cigarettes has not ever been found to cause cancer and heart disease beyond a reasonable doubt but I seriously doubt you'd tell your teenage son to smoke because this high burden of proof hasn't been met.

If I was on a jury I'd judge the situation and weigh the evidence based on the burden of proof required for the type of case. But, don't worry, I always get sent home early in any jury selection process because of my profession.

So, is Big Ben guilty of a criminal offense? No. No charge is being brought. Read up on sexual assault cases or talk to local DAs and they can tell you why these are very challenging cases, especially in this media age of C.S.I. fandom, to try.

Is Big Ben a rapist if applying common sense and the evidence we have heard? To me, yes. If that bothers you, that's your problem.

[Pocket$ $traight]

Originally Posted by Moondog

You're missing the point.

And so are you. You don't know what happened. You are assuming that you know what happened. Unless you were in the bathroom, you are making an assumption based on available information.

Do you think Ben did something wrong. Yes.
Do I think that Ben did something wrong in GA. Yes

Do either of us know for a fact that Ben did something wrong. No.

If I had to bet my mortgage on a crime being commited vs. not being commited I would bet that he did something. Do I think Ben is a scumbag? Yes, but that is also based off of a pretty heavy media campaign placing him in an unfavorable light.

The Duke lacrosse case looked pretty cut and dry too.

There is a lot of grey area here which is complicated by the fact that alcohol was involved.

[tryfuhl]

Originally Posted by GMScud

I had to LMAO at this one. PFT and Florio are a constant subject of criticism on this website. I read PFT a few times a week. Not because I like the site, but more because I like to scour for rumors and pick and choose what I think is plausible.

Florio had this preface to his post about Big Ben trade rumors:

It's one thing for the Internet to spawn sports rumors. Many of them come from message boards or slapdicks like me who throw stuff against the wall. Those rumors rarely register a blip.

HA! He flat out acknowledges what a hack he is. "Slapdicks like me..." "Those rumors rarely register a blip." LOL. At least Florio knows who he is.

Already, the Big Ben trade rumors start | ProFootballTalk.com

I literally lol'd last night when I read that