2015 Draft Prospects... First Edition

[EARTHQUAKE2689]

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

So ... the latest twitter banter amongst the Skins' folks is that Scot likes Cooper at 5.

Thoughts?

Best offensive player in the draft, if he is there and we take him, I won't shed a tear at all.

[redskinsfan1980]

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

So ... the latest twitter banter amongst the Skins' folks is that Scot likes Cooper at 5.

Thoughts?

That would be a horrible idea. We already have tons of money invested in the wr core. We need a pass rush, secondary help, and another legit pass rusher. Anything that doesn't address one of these needs would be retarded. I understand the best player available theory. But no one could make an legitimate argument for drafting wr with that fifth pick.

[redskinsfan1980]

Originally Posted by EARTHQUAKE2689

Best offensive player in the draft, if he is there and we take him, I won't shed a tear at all.

But what sense would it make to grab a player at a position that we clearly don't need? Right now we need a pass rusher. We need OL help everywhere except LT. We need a quality safety. What we don't need is another wr.

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by redskinsfan1980

That would be a horrible idea. We already have tons of money invested in the wr core. We need a pass rush, secondary help, and another legit pass rusher. Anything that doesn't address one of these needs would be retarded. I understand the best player available theory. But no one could make an legitimate argument for drafting wr with that fifth pick.

Challenge accepted.

First, I am not saying you will agree with them, I am just going to point out that there are some very "legitimate arguments" for picking Cooper.

In a vacuum, given what is expected to happen in slots 1-4, Cooper is a almost a no-brainer. After Winston, he is the consensus best offensive player (McShay & Kiper have him at No. 3 overall on the board) and it is expected that Winston and at least one pass-rushing OLB/DE's will be picked before No. 5. No safeties or lineman are rated as top 5 picks - or even top 10 picks for that matter. So, if we stay at 5, we have our choice of the 3rd rated player overall and the best WR prospect or sloppy seconds at OLB. Seems pretty straight forward to me.

But, of course, we aren't picking in a vacuum. You are right, we have substantial money currently tied up in the WR position - but, for how long? Garcon is contracted through the end of this year. Jackson & Roberts through the end of next. After the top three, Ryan Grant was our 4th and, while dirt cheap, he is also developmental with the likely top end being a good slot WR. As to the top three, Roberts did not exactly tear it up as a 3rd WR. Garcon will be 30 at the beginning of the 2017 season - do we try to resign him to another FA contract? Jackson - much as I love what he does for us - has a volatile history; can we count on him to finish his contract? Bottom line, in a best case scenario, we may need a WR1 or WR2 to replace someone after this season and may need to replace our WR1, WR2 and WR3 after the next.

If you look strictly short term, yes - OLB seems the reasonable choice. However, this draft is stocked with solid OLB talent and we have decent (not great) OLB talent on the roster in Murphy/Kerrigan so we don't need a starter at the position but can get a developmental player. Again, the line and safety positions simply don't have anyone worth the No. 5 selection.

On the other hand, if you are drafting long-term, Cooper makes perfect sense. By all accounts he is a possible pro-bowler in the making - closer to Calvin Johnson than Charles Rodgers. He has a year develop behind Garcon and gives us flexibility & cap space at the position just as we are losing are current WR's. If we stay at No. 5, Cooper provides long-term security.

When you get down to it, the draft is a crap shoot no matter how you cut it. Lots of "sure-fire" picks fail. The way to succeed is to do one of two things: (1) fire as many darts as you can - i.e. get lots of picks and take your best shots; and (2) aim for the biggest targets - i.e. pick the best guys on the board regardless of whether or not they fit an immediate need b/c, in this game, today's surplus is tomorrow's area of need. (Just look at SF - two years ago, they had one of the premier LB corps in the league, today - not so much).

And, finally, the most compelling argument of all: If Scotty McC does it, it must be right.

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

So ... the latest twitter banter amongst the Skins' folks is that Scot likes Cooper at 5.

Thoughts?

I like Kevin White better, but Cooper is a close second at WR. The expectation for a WR at 5 is he starts right away. So Garcon the number 3 at that cap number...? And Roberts a 4 at that cap number? The answer is clearly no, better ways to spend your money

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

I like Kevin White better, but Cooper is a close second at WR. The expectation for a WR at 5 is he starts right away. So Garcon the number 3 at that cap number...? And Roberts a 4 at that cap number? The answer is clearly no, better ways to spend your money

Again, I get it but, if you draft for the short term, you lessen your chances at success and end up always chasing needs. If you draft the better prospect, regardless of position, then you are addressing problems before they become needs and you give yourself greater flexibility year to year.

Also, if drafted, I wouldn't mind Cooper displacing Roberts as the no. 3 this year - regardless of cap money, the better production starts. The following year, cut Roberts, no need to resign Garcon or draft a WR1 and our top 3 are still Cooper, Jackson, and Grant - probably a very solid trio.

Like I said, you may not agree with it, but there are perfectly reasonable arguments to be made for Cooper at 5.

[SFREDSKIN]

There will be other best players available that the team needs. Gregory, Ray, Fowler could be there and we "need" a pass rusher.

[EARTHQUAKE2689]

Originally Posted by redskinsfan1980

But what sense would it make to grab a player at a position that we clearly don't need? Right now we need a pass rusher. We need OL help everywhere except LT. We need a quality safety. What we don't need is another wr.

I stand by my statement

[KI Skins Fan]

Positions of need factor into the "best player available" draft strategy. If a player who plays a position of need is judged to be close in draft value to one who plays a position where there is little need, then SM may take the player at the position on need. But if the player who is not at a position of need is judged to be a much better prospect than the one at a position of need, then SM would probably take the much better player. Every team makes these types of value judgements. Draft strategies are not black and white but shades of gray.

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by KI Skins Fan

Positions of need factor into the "best player available" draft strategy. If a player who plays a position of need is judged to be close in draft value to one who plays a position where there is little need, then SM may take the player at the position on need. But if the player who is not at a position of need is judged to be a much better prospect than the one at a position of need, then SM would probably take the much better player. Every team makes these types of value judgements. Draft strategies are not black and white but shades of gray.

Agreed. Scotty is apparently very interested in Cooper. The question is: How much better does SM think Cooper is than Fowler or one of the other top 3 OLB prospects?

[JoeRedskin]

Just went back and looked B. Irvin coming out of W.Va. in 2012 when SMcC was with Seattle. In terms of their measurables, he is similar to Randy Gregory although Irvin had a little more weight coming out (235 v. 248). Both are speed rushers and most draftniks at the time felt Irvin was a reach as pass-rushing DE.

If McC thinks Gregory otherwise fits his profile, I can see McC not being deterred by Gregory's lack of weight.

[NYCskinfan82]

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

Agreed. Scotty is apparently very interested in Cooper. The question is: How much better does SM think Cooper is than Fowler or one of the other top 3 OLB prospects?

I am late to this were is the article saying Scotty is very interested in Cooper.

[SFREDSKIN]

If Scot is seriously interested in Cooper then I would say adios to Garçon cause he will be traded. I just can't see 3 highly paid WR's (Cooper will be the cheapest) in one team. I call it a bluff.

[EARTHQUAKE2689]

Originally Posted by SFREDSKIN

If Scot is seriously interested in Cooper then I would say adios to Garçon cause he will be traded. I just can't see 3 highly paid WR's (Cooper will be the cheapest) in one team. I call it a bluff.

I don't, he didn't sign Garcon but I don't see him trading him either.

[warriorzpath]

Originally Posted by SFREDSKIN

If Scot is seriously interested in Cooper then I would say adios to Garçon cause he will be traded. I just can't see 3 highly paid WR's (Cooper will be the cheapest) in one team. I call it a bluff.

In the draft, Devante Parker and Dorial Green-Beckham would be a better fit for the Redskins because of their strong red-zone ability. I've heard both being compared to AJ Green because of their size, ball skills, and athleticism.

Only problem with Green-Beckham is off-field risks for availability, but he probably won't make it past the 1st round.

And yes, there is a considerable amount of investment at the wr position, but right now it's mainly dollars and cap space and that's completely different than investing a high first round choice would be. And these wide receivers would fill one of the biggest holes on the redskins - a big red-zone target.