Jay Gruden you are our only hope

[Skinzman]

Originally Posted by Hijinx

You are talking about 1 game. Lets take RG3's last 16 not counting the Jax game he get hurt 5 mins in. In 16 games 18 TDs, 15 INT, and 7 fumbles, 53 sacks taken. Twenty two turnovers just by himself in 16 games, thats elite. Now before you even start making excuses about the O-line and those sacks, a ton of them are on him. He holds the ball WAY, WAY, WAY, too long, everyone says so. Now the O-line is leaky for sure, but it is no way, sooo much worse than every other O-line that he should be sacked this many times. In fact this season RG3 has been sacked 13% of his pass attempts, Colt 10%, and Kirk only 3.8%. Last year RG3 sacked on 7.7% of attempts, Kirk 3.1.

You want to use the D as an excuse? Know who had the 9th most punts in 2013? Rocca. Know why so many? Because RG3 can not do crap on 3rd down, except get sacked. Want to know why he wasn't 1st in number of punts? Because RG3's 22 turnovers, but I guess that is on the D. Crappy Offensive play puts pressure on the D. Not the other way around.

Or you can use RG3 excuse #28302 , it is the coaching staff. Once he gets the right coaches who knows how to coach he will be great. Go check how well the Browns are doing with Kyle Shanahan, without a decent WR, and Hoyer as their QB.

Or you can use RG3 excuse #63840 wellll hes hurt as soon as he gets healthy, we will see this great elite QB. Ya but he is brittle a hell, he missed time in 2 out of 4 college seasons and 3 out of 3 NFL seasons. So keep hoping that he will ever last a whole season.

Or you can use RG3 excuse #34405: his teammates don't play hard enough. He tried to use that one yesterday when he threw his teammates under the bus. Best throw of the day, BTW.

Or you use RG3 excuse #19083 : "The Haters" whatever the Hell that is

At some point you have to stop making excuses and either produce or get lost.

You have still not understood most of my points. This all started about a conversation about developing QB's. As I told Punch, you want to draft QB after QB and watch them be ruined. I want to fix the developing problem then worry about the QB. I have said before that if it isnt Griffin, so be it.

But your solution is to put in someone who did just as bad if not worse. Its a stupid solution and I will call it out every time. Fix the problem first, then get the QB. Stop inserting QB x, watch him fail, insert QB y, watch him fail, insert QB z, watch him fail... then blame Snyder. Thats not a solution except to several people on this board.

If its not Griffin, so be it. But drafting and ruining is a horrible strategy. I dont know why so many people think it will eventually work after the 5 thousandth time. It wont work the way its being done. As Einstein said, Insanity is trying the same thing over and over again thinking you will get different results.

Btw, Im not one who has blamed the coaching staff. I got chewed out for saying to give Shanny his five years because I was sick of the turnover. But hey, the guy you hated is now having success somewhere else so blame me for that as well. Makes sense. I also dont recall calling anyone a hater. Called plenty of people idiots, but hater, not me.

Btw... I know... I know... Defense doesnt matter, only the QB. Yes I will talk about the defense, because when you have to score 40 to win, then the QB tends to do stupid shit trying to make up those points. Yes I will talk about the Oline, since they are a major problem in why we can never get a QB going.

Look at Kirk when he first came in. He was tearing it up early, then started taking hits. After that, it was lock and throw immediately, regardless of what team he threw to. Thats what you want? Really? Hey at least his sack numbers per pass play are down even if he locks onto the safety and throws it right at him for an int. It does not take EVERY single rush to get there for it to have an effect. There were plenty of times with a whole lot of QB's that take hits and start doing these rookie things. It really only takes so many times of having your center and guards pushed back into your face before you look to move outside the pocket instead of climb into it. Its a development problem and it needs to be fixed. QB's cant develop that way, they never do.

This team might as well have zero backups except the QB position and sign 15 of them. Then we can switch QB's to your hearts content while nothing still works. But you still have Snyder to blame so who cares if the problem is ever fixed.

[Gary84Clark]

smh please put McCoy in so when he turns into McCoy we get a new coach. RG3 Romo's sucessor?

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by Gary84Clark

smh please put McCoy in so when he turns into McCoy we get a new coach. RG3 Romo's sucessor?

Does Gary Clark know that you are using his number?

[Gary84Clark]

Originally Posted by punch it in

Does Gary Clark know that you are using his number?

Serious, I'm tired of the drama let RG3 go. It's not doing him or the team any good. Let's see what you got next. I'm ready to start judging Gruden for Gruden. They had a bye and laid an egg. COACHING red flag!

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by Gary84Clark

Serious, I'm tired of the drama let RG3 go. It's not doing him or the team any good. Let's see what you got next. I'm ready to start judging Gruden for Gruden. They had a bye and laid an egg. COACHING red flag!

Damn Gary84Clark asking for RG-3 to be shown the door? What is this world coming to?

[SolidSnake84]

I think that like others have posted out - benching RG3 for the rest of the year and then jettisoning him would be a move that would show that we are moving past the BS and are serious about putting only winners on the field. Someone posted a stat line of RG3's record, it is something like 9-30, which is horrible.

Then again - i'm not sure if Gruden has the power/autonomy to make decisions like that. He seems like a good guy but he knows how it works in DC. It wouldn't surprise me if he's already been told that RG3 plays no matter what...

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by SolidSnake84

I think that like others have posted out - benching RG3 for the rest of the year and then jettisoning him would be a move that would show that we are moving past the BS and are serious about putting only winners on the field. Someone posted a stat line of RG3's record, it is something like 9-30, which is horrible.



Then again - i'm not sure if Gruden has the power/autonomy to make decisions like that. He seems like a good guy but he knows how it works in DC. It wouldn't surprise me if he's already been told that RG3 plays no matter what...

12-18. I think he has played 30 games.
Edit: something closer to this anyway.

[Gary84Clark]

Originally Posted by punch it in

12-18. I think he has played 30 games.
Edit: something closer to this anyway.

Let him play the season out. He is young he won't find success here. I would hate to have to troll Cousins fans because Colt is more injury prone than RG. He has concussion issues.

[KI Skins Fan]

Originally Posted by Hijinx

In 16 games 18 TDs, 15 INT, and 7 fumbles, 53 sacks taken. Twenty two turnovers just by himself in 16 games, thats elite.

Now before you even start making excuses about the O-line and those sacks, a ton of them are on him. He holds the ball WAY, WAY, WAY, too long, everyone says so.

RG3 can not do crap on 3rd down, except get sacked.

Or you can use RG3 excuse #28302 , it is the coaching staff. Once he gets the right coaches who knows how to coach he will be great. Go check how well the Browns are doing with Kyle Shanahan, without a decent WR, and Hoyer as their QB.

Or you can use RG3 excuse #63840 wellll hes hurt as soon as he gets healthy, we will see this great elite QB. Ya but he is brittle a hell, he missed time in 2 out of 4 college seasons and 3 out of 3 NFL seasons. So keep hoping that he will ever last a whole season.

Or you can use RG3 excuse #34405: his teammates don't play hard enough. He tried to use that one yesterday when he threw his teammates under the bus. Best throw of the day, BTW.

Or you use RG3 excuse #19083 : "The Haters" whatever the Hell that is

At some point you have to stop making excuses and either produce or get lost.

You made a number of very good points. I have supported Robert but I can't deny my ongoing concerns about everything you posted. Unfortunately, there is even more about his game to be concerned about. Yet, he has talent. It feels like Catch 22 to me.

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by SFREDSKIN

Here's an excellent RGIII assessment from a Baylor fan:

Like I have said before. He is a spread quarterback playing in a west coast offense. It does not fit him. He needs to go to a place that runs the true spread. Not the read option, but a run and shoot style spread. That is the bases of our offense here at Baylor. He would understand those concepts and elements better. There is too much of a thought process that goes on with the west coast especially the one hat both Gruden's run. Not only do you have to read the defense, but you have to regurgitate ridiculously long plays that tells everyone what to do; you have to time your drop back with the routes, receivers have to run predetermined routes, and you have about 5 reads. He has to do all this on top of having an offensive line not built to pass protect. He does have issues holding the ball to long. He needs to just let a rip; but honestly he wasn't ready to carry a bad organization. People put to much on him and in fairness he put way to much on himself. I think he was feeling himself just a little, but not as much as it was portrayed; after winning the Heisman and then rookie of the year. He probably thought that he would be able to handle saving a dismal organization. But many great qbs don't have to. As bad as the Colts were people forget the year before they tanked that they made it to the second round of the playoffs. Indy top to bottom was a solid organization when Andrew went there. To make it even more easier on him, the colts brought in his offensive coordinator from Sanford, so he is practically 7 years into the offense that he is directing. He is comfortable because he knows it in and out. That was not the case for Rob. And many would say well the Shanahan's installed the read option for Robert to get him comfortable so that's a wash. No they didn't. Many don't understand that Rob didn't run a read option offense in college. Art Briles offense is not a read option offense. It is a run and shoot hybrid offense with receivers running option routes versus the way the defense is lined up. Quarterback and receivers on the fly determine where to go with the ball and what route to run based on coverage. And there for the pass opens up the run. If you look at stats except for his freshman year Rob didn't run the ball for more than 650 in a season. That was on par with Luck at Stanford. The Shanahan's used Nevada's offensive formation (read option) Rob's rookie year. I know this is long but I am passionate about my bears and seeing them do well in all their endeavors. He needs a change of scenery particularly in a place that has a small media market with a solid organization top to bottom from players, coaches, front office, and owner. He needs a place that runs a spread offense that allows him to make easier pre snap adjustments without heavy progressions and verbiage and will allow him to get in a rythym becaus he is a rythym thrower. And preferably a place where he can sit behind a veteran qb for a couple of years, rest his body, and learn. A place where he doesn't have to be the guy. Denver is a small market city that meet these criterias. New England as well. In fact they have a rookie qb behind Tom Brady that ran our offense for Coach Babers at Eastern Illinois. That's how closely aligned the Patriots offense is with ours. It's not as eccentric and elaborate as ours (there is only one Coach Briles and one Baylor offense) but it is a run and shoot offense so it embodies the same base principals.
Last edited by CoachHBU2008; 11-16-14 at 04:14 PM.

This post is so so poor, I think its the worse thing Ive ever seen on the board. So RG3 needs to go to a run and shoot team like Denver or New England? jesus christ what an idiot. He sounds like a college football fan.

The problem we are facing is that atheleticism will never hid poor fundemental passing concepts for a QB. Its been proven time and time again.

[Avinash_Tyagi]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

Seriously? Both of you? How is it Jay's fault that he was strapped with a shit DC leftover from Shanny's regime? How come he's overridden on QB calls on who to play? Why is Gruden getting the blame for Robert's progress? Maybe Jay is teaching him, but he isn't learning shit?

Drama returns to Redskins Park - Washington Redskins Blog - ESPN




He's being taught properly. It's the QB not doing what he's supposed to do which is the problem.

I will agree with you Matty that Jay probably shouldn't be this upfront in his press conferences. He should take notes from BB on how to do them.

No gotta disagree

Gruden can't keep discipline in his team, and he doesn't seem to be capable to making adjustments to improve the team's play.

He seems to think that all he needs to do is tell his players to do something and they'll do it.

This unending drama would have never happened under Gibbs

I don't think Gruden is the long term answer as head coach (3 seasons and out I think)

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by NC_Skins

Seriously? Both of you? How is it Jay's fault that he was strapped with a shit DC leftover from Shanny's regime? How come he's overridden on QB calls on who to play? Why is Gruden getting the blame for Robert's progress? Maybe Jay is teaching him, but he isn't learning shit?

Drama returns to Redskins Park - Washington Redskins Blog - ESPN




He's being taught properly. It's the QB not doing what he's supposed to do which is the problem.

I will agree with you Matty that Jay probably shouldn't be this upfront in his press conferences. He should take notes from BB on how to do them.

How do you explain Pierre Garcon going from one of the most reliable receivers in the NFL under the Shanahans to a complete after thought under Gruden? How do you explain the lack of improvement in special teams despite the obvious investment in them in the form of special teams specialists? How do you explain the lack of discipline with penalties, lining up wrong, receivers false starting on their own QB's hard count?

And Cousins. How do you explain him throwing countless INTs? Is he being careless, sure. But his coaches sure didn't make a positive impact.

This crap can't all be on Griffin. It's systemic. Gruden needs to show why he was hired and take this team by the balls and lead it. Like really lead it. He needs to be acting like Bill Parcells if someone pissed in his coffee.

[SFREDSKIN]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

This post is so so poor, I think its the worse thing Ive ever seen on the board. So RG3 needs to go to a run and shoot team like Denver or New England? jesus christ what an idiot. He sounds like a college football fan.

The problem we are facing is that atheleticism will never hid poor fundemental passing concepts for a QB. Its been proven time and time again.

What I was getting at was that Shanahan had him playing the spread cause he was familiar with it and had a hard time learning the WCO, which he still does, as well as the pocket presence.

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by SFREDSKIN

What I was getting at was that Shanahan had him playing the spread cause he was familiar with it and had a hard time learning the WCO, which he still does, as well as the pocket presence.

Well he needs to recognize defenses too and where you go with the ball. These are the differences in a garbage Baylor, texas am and tcu schemes vs a pro style Stanford team. You want a QB who knows the basics coming out. The thing with RG3 is seems like a smart, hard worker, and high character guy who could be coached to learn how to become a pocket passer.

But he seems to be more worried about social media and not taking the responsibility for the teams poor play. I dont ever want to see RG3 do that again at a press conference when he deflects responsibilty. Its year 3, no more of that shit.

You see Peyton at the podium after the loss against St. Louis? Thats why that dude wins and has the support of every team he's ever been on. Peyton put that loss all on him. RG3 needs to man the fuck up and do the same.

[SirLK26]

Originally Posted by Lotus

You are right. In fact,Griffin essentially sacks himself. By holding the ball as he does, realistically he often says, "Please sack me."

The fact that, after sacking himself repeatedly, he still called out other players made me lose respect for RGIII, and I am one of his backers. You can't call out others like that because you are too arrogant to admit that you f***ed up.

No wonder his development is so stunted. No matter how hard you work, it is hard to improve if you spend your time admiring your reflection.

“All the sacks are on me, period."

"When I say, ‘All the sacks on are me,’ I’m saying I can do better and I have to do better."

"I will be the first to say I could have done better, a lot better.”

"I didn’t see the field as well as I would have liked to."

"I am not playing that way[at a high level]..."

"I haven’t watched the film yet but I know there are some plays that I would like to have back – of course the interceptions, and there are a couple of plays that come to mind where I feel like I could have been more aggressive. Those plays are in my head. They will stay in my head..."

"I promise you that I will get better."