Did we gain more respect in a loss than we have in our 3 wins?

[MTK]

I think we could see some tunes change a bit this week, here's the first indication that we're starting to open some eyes.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?page=eod/week5
By Michael Smith
ESPN.com

Denver won the game, but the Broncos and Redskins both should have earned more national respect. A 21-19 victory at Invesco Field made it four straight for the Broncos since they wilted in the South Florida heat back on opening day. Denver, as always, has a dominant running game, and now it has a quarterback, Jake Plummer (left), playing efficient football. The defense is there again, too. Know where the two-time defending champion Patriots are next week? At Denver, in what will be one of the marquee matchups of Week 6.

As for the Redskins, I thought they were for real even before they came within a two-point conversion of tying Sunday's game at Denver. The Redskins have doubters because they've won by the skin of their teeth (their three victories were by a combined six points) but the Patriots have built a dynasty on close victories. Why is New England praised for making plays at the end of games while Washington is knocked for it? Mark Brunell is authoring one of the best stories in the league this year. The 'Skins will be in this thing for a while.

[mooby]

well that article is the first sign of respect i've seen this year, and that's saying something. i don't know yet, i'd have to see how most of the media reacts to it rather than 1 person, i'll make my decision later in the week probably.

[MTK]

More props:

Broncos struggled getting to Brunell

DENVER -- The rain poured. The wind blew. Broncos players kept shaking their heads, but the Washington Redskins, the little engine that could, just wouldn't go away.

Coach Mike Shanahan's squad built an 11-point lead in the third quarter. Normally, a good Broncos team -- and this is a good one -- would pressure the quarterback for sacks and surgically and methodically end their opponent's misery with the run game. Against the Redskins, they couldn't. Quarterback Mark Brunell kept dropping back, with everyone except Joe Gibbs and Sonny Jurgensen protecting him, and firing passes.




AP Photo/David Zalubowski
Mark Brunell attempted 53 passes on Sunday, but wasn't sacked.



With 1:15 remaining in the game, Brunell rolled left and spotted David Patten open in the back of the end zone. But Broncos linebacker Ian Gold, in single coverage against tight end Chris Cooley, jumped up and deflected away what would have been the game-tying two-point conversion. The Broncos won Sunday's game 21-19, but the Redskins (3-1) gained ground for respect.

"They are for real," Broncos safety John Lynch said. "They are playing great defense. Offensively, they are playing great football. They are at the top of the league in third-down conversions. They got big-time, explosive players on offense. They are tough to deal with."

And a weird team to watch. Gibbs runs an offense that looks more like rugby than American football. Most of the time, Brunell calls plays out of two-tight-end sets. It's rare that more than two or three receivers venture out for pass routes. Because seven or eight players stay in to protect Brunell, he has time to move the ball downfield.

"Their scheme is one of those crazy things you have to see to believe," Broncos defensive end Trevor Pryce said. "They do so much max protecting. You try to rush one blocker, but he's not paying attention to you. He's worried about the guy coming outside of you. Coaches are yelling, 'Go get them,' but go get what? As a rusher a lot of times, you are null and void. It's like trying to penetrate Fort Knox with nine people standing there."

Brunell, at the age of 35, has found the fountain of youth in Gibbs' second season at the helm. Because the Redskins keep in so many blockers to protect him, he dropped back on 53 pass plays Sunday and wasn't sacked once. He completed 30 passes for 322 yards and two touchdowns, and overall, the Redskins ran 79 offensive plays to the Broncos' 54.

From one 20-yard line to the next, opposing defenses are having an impossible time stopping the Redskins. Gibbs has a goal to be balanced with the run and the pass, but Brunell was having better success moving the football through the air. Clinton Portis, the former Bronco, had a respectable day against a tough Broncos defense by rushing for 103 yards on 20 carries. Shanahan was willing to concede that. It was Brunell who was the untouchable one.

The Broncos tried everything. On downs in which the Redskins needed 10 or more yards for a first down, the Broncos tried variations of the old Chicago Bears 46 defense in which six players stacked the line with an extra rusher overloading one side. Brunell was untouched.

"They used so many two-man routes in which they had eight in protection," Pryce said. "You've got to be good to be able to do that, and they are. We probably should have rushed only three instead of four or more, because it didn't make any difference. It's frustrating to go against them."

But it's also frustrating to be a Redskins fan. Gibbs plays that offense so close to the vest that the Redskins won't be a high-scoring team. They've played well in four games, yet they've only scored 62 points. Coming into the game, the Redskins and the Broncos were tied as the third-worst team with seven red zone opportunities. For the season, the Redskins have scored only six offensive touchdowns in 43 possessions.

"From our standpoint, I'm proud of our players," Gibbs said. "They fought their guts out. I was proud of them fighting back like that. When you play on the road, you go up against a lot. We had some very critical plays tonight. You obviously never want it to end on one play. We made a number of mistakes that hurt us tonight."

In fact, there were two costly mistakes in the first quarter that contributed to Washington falling behind early. Brunell and Portis misjudged each other on a delayed handoff, resulting in a fumble during the first possession that the Broncos recovered at Washington's 43.

Four plays later, on fourth-and-1 from the 34, Jake Plummer audibled away from the strength of the Redskins' run blitz. Still, Gregg Williams' defense had two defenders in position to make the tackle. However, they missed Tatum Bell, who made a spectacular 34-yard run to give the Broncos a 7-0 lead.

After that, the Broncos' offense was stuck in neutral. Despite not having starting cornerback Walt Harris for the game and Shawn Springs for three quarters because of a shin injury, Williams devised a brilliant scheme in which his defensive backs protected against the pass in a four-man zone to prevent big plays. While doing that, his defensive front seven stuffed every gap, and at one point, limited the Broncos and Plummer to five consecutive three-and-outs.

“ They are for real. They are playing great defense. Offensively, they are playing great football. They are at the top of the league in third-down conversions. They got big-time, explosive players on offense. They are tough to deal with.”
—Broncos S John Lynch

"We tried to protect our young cornerbacks, and we did so many things well to take away a very good run game and a very good boot game, but we gave up two long runs because we missed tackles," Williams said. "We had guys in position to make tackles. Going into the game, we were No. 1 in the league in yards after contact and yards after the catch. Today we missed some tackles. Against these guys, we probably did as good as they've seen in stopping the run."

On two critical runs, though, there was no stopping Bell. The second-year back, who was acquired with the draft pick the Broncos got in the Portis-Champ Bailey trade in 2004, scored on a 55-yard run in the third quarter to give Denver the 21-10 lead.

"You can always find a running back in this league, but finding a shutdown cornerback like Champ is hard. They don't come around too often," said Bell, who finished with 127 yards on 12 carries. "Champ [who missed his second straight game because a hamstring injury] will be back when we need him. I think we got the better end of that deal."

Even more important, they got the benefit of a replay reversal earlier in the third quarter. On Denver's second possession, Redskins defensive end Renaldo Wynn reached around right tackle George Foster and made Plummer lose the ball while in his throwing motion. Plummer recovered it in the end zone but was tackled by cornerback Ade Jimoh for a safety. Shanahan challenged the call, which was reversed because of the Tuck Rule. Instead of the Redskins trailing 14-12 and getting the ball, the Broncos retained possession.

"You could see right away that it was the Tuck Rule," Shanahan said. "I didn't think the official had a real good angle, because he wasn't looking at the quarterback, but the replay showed it right away."

Undeterred, Brunell kept dropping back in his Pentagon of protection and kept throwing. He drove the Redskins to a field goal midway through the fourth quarter, and started an amazing final drive from his 6 in the first five minutes.

The only time the Broncos got to Brunell was on a 9-yard sack on a fourth down at the Redskins 49, but that was negated when Broncos rookie corner Karl Paymah was called for defensive holding, giving Brunell second life. Three plays later, Paymah gave the Redskins another chance with a 15-yard penalty for spearing wide receiver Santana Moss along the sideline.

Eventually, though, the breaks came to an end for Washington.

"In situations like that, somebody has to make a play, and Ian Gold finally did," Lynch said. "At some point, somebody has to step up."

John Clayton is a senior writer for ESPN.com.

[BigSKINBauer]

we played our best game today, we deserve it. Had we of won we would be seriously top 3 in the NFC. I know that sounds homerish but we are a good team.

We deserve this respect more today than we did after the dallas, bears, or seahawk games because our TEAM played great. No doubt in my mind if we were to play the broncos in a neutral location(like the superbowl????) we would win.----By the way i am not saying we are going to the superbowl----

[SKINSnCANES]

we lost today, but this is the best Ive felt after a game all year. We looked like a football team. I had a blast watching the game. Its sad to say, but the Skins have been boring to watch in recent years. We have been lackluster and unproductive. We actually posted huge numbers today and were in it unti the end. Our defensive lost the gaem today with those two runs, not the offensive.

After today I finally feel like we can compete and win against anyone, even though we lost.

[JWsleep]

I never feel good after a loss.

But we played well enough to win it in a tough place, even though penalties and turnovers hurt. I was impressed by their heart, and the offense looked very good, though we still only got 19. Very impressed with Portis, actually. He came back in after being hurt, was awesome on blitz pickup--did you see the one where he just flatened an LB?--and he got over 100. Plus, I loved that first TD drive. They had so many tough penalties there. Last year, they fold it up and punt. This year, they drive right back down there and cram it in to the endzone. That was a serious drive. So there were definite positives.

My biggest question is how is the team going to react. We go right back out to KC next week, in another very hostile environment. They are coming off a bye, and are getting some of their key O-line players back. We will have to actually WIN the TO battle, not committ lots of penalties, not allow a blocked kick, not give up big plays to Priest Holmes and Larry Johnson, not to mention Gonzales. And then we MIGHT win it. It would be very easy to say, "well, this is a tough road game, we're not expected to win, and we've got SF next week" and mail it in. But if they show up like they did this week, and play even better (they have, at least on offense, gotten better each game), then we may get somthing going.

This is the toughest back to back weeks of our schedule, in many ways--we've got to step it up even more.

So I am impressed, but not happy. There are lots of positives, but it's not there yet.

[redrock-skins]

"Even though the Redskins lost this game it's time for the Redskins to be taken seriously as a contender in the NFC. They have an excellent defense that provided pressure on the quarterback and a defensive backfield that can make plays. In addition to that they have a renewed Mark Brunell on offense who Joe Gibbs has a lot of faith in as a player. Brunell gives this team the run-pass option that makes their offense difficult for opposing defenses to game plan against."
-- Eric Allen ESPN

[GoSkins!]

I bet our passing game did. Do you really think that teams are going to just stack the box against Portis when our QB can put up 300 yards passing?

Wierd, but I think that the offense is starting to look good. The defense won't have to win every game for us this year. Our d allowed 21 points yesterday which, for them, is unimaginable. Our offense is scorig more each game, and could have kicked the extra point to make it 20 points. If we can get to 24 or more points a game, we could win 10 more games this year.

[Hog1]

Great posts all! It's easy to be a Skins fan today! Yes, now the league will have to respect them! They ARE legitimate. They are a force on both sides of the ball. Yes, they made mistakes, but under the WORST of possible weather conditions, they staged a raging comeback. They didn't fall apart, they weren't mercy "prevent D" late 4th quarter points. They were hard fought Blizzard points ripped from the guts of a stingy D, by an Offense with it's own identity. An offense that wil have to be reckoned with, not overlooked. Special teams broke out wiht some FOOTBALL plays as well. Without some questionable calls, they win that game. I gotta' say, Brunell has NO give-up. YES, we gained more respect with the loss than 3 wins! Good Job ADE!!!

[Paintrain]

If nothing else, hopefully we've gained enough respect from Fox that they will not make us listen to the WORST analyst in the NFL today, Bill Maas, anymore.. That guy made the game almost unbearable to watch..
Among his gems from yesterday:
Maas, we can see the rain, shut up. We know the ball is wet, shut up.
'The Drive' was in Cleveland, on 'right here on this field' as he said in the 4th qtr.
He said the Skins should have taken a penalty to move the ball back 5 yds right before Frost dropped the ball inside the 10 and was downed at the 2.
Just about all of his telestrations were off.

Give us Stockton, Moose and Goose if we can't get the "A" team of Buck and Aikman. I think we've earned at least that much respect..

[celts32]

Originally Posted by Paintrain

If nothing else, hopefully we've gained enough respect from Fox that they will not make us listen to the WORST analyst in the NFL today, Bill Maas, anymore.. That guy made the game almost unbearable to watch..
Among his gems from yesterday:
Maas, we can see the rain, shut up. We know the ball is wet, shut up.
'The Drive' was in Cleveland, on 'right here on this field' as he said in the 4th qtr.
He said the Skins should have taken a penalty to move the ball back 5 yds right before Frost dropped the ball inside the 10 and was downed at the 2.
Just about all of his telestrations were off.

Give us Stockton, Moose and Goose if we can't get the "A" team of Buck and Aikman. I think we've earned at least that much respect..

Amen to that...those guys are terrible. My favorite was when they showed SuperBowl XXII highlites and called it the 1st of 3 super bowls for Gibbs. Not abig dela in terms of yesterdays game...but get your damn facts straight... if your going to show the clip it is your job to know that was the 2nd of 3 bowls for Gibbs!

[TheMalcolmConnection]

You think anyone in Denver is still thinking Portis is a "system back" after he gashed them for 100+ yards rushing and receiving. He would have had even more rushing yards had it not been for a couple of penalties.

[BrudLee]

Glad someone started this thread.

Paintrain, thanks for bringing up the horrible announcing team. My "favorite" Maas/Rosen moment was when they didn't know why Novak was being attended to on the sidelines after getting smacked tackling the return man. They actually slo-mo'ed him through the whole kickoff.

This does frustrate me. As a professional team-ranker (I am getting paid, right Matty?), it galls me that a 3-0 team is a joke - and make no mistake, that's what 80% of the pundits thought of us - but a 3-1 team is a contender.

This loss isn't horrible. Out of conference, on the road, against a very good team that's markedly better at home, in rotten weather, with mediocre (though not entirely one-sided) officiating. We are still 1st in division, since division record is the first tiebreaker. We have another tough road game - KC and Denver are probably the hardest places to visit in the league. KC is also coming off of a bye, which gives them more of an advantage.

The simple truth is that sometimes (I'm looking at you, Philadelphia), a loss exposes a team weakness. Sometimes (cough, cough, New Orleans!, cough), you get flat-out shelled. And sometimes more good things and fewer bad things happen to the other team than happen to you. No real shame in that loss.

[MTK]

At least you guys didn't have to listen to the Denver homer announcers on NFL field pass.

It was really hard to tell when the Skins were doing anything good, even when they would score a TD the announcer was so monotone and nonchalant with the call it was really frustrating.