Laron Landry = Lavar?

[freddyg12]

Dirty 30 is a guy that I wish I could like more. I know he is coming off an injury & he was playing lights out last year beforehand. But the 2nd half TD incident w/London in his face sunday really made me think about his overall approach to the game. Something's been wrong w/this defense the last couple weeks, I wonder if he's part of the problem.

He is great at making big hits, but if you watch him take on blockers he usually takes himself out of the play. His coverage issues have been talked about by us quite a bit.

Is Laron our present day Lavar? A big hitter but undisciplined? Is he a Shanahan guy? I'm actually wondering if the staff feels he's worth investing in beyond his current deal.

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by freddyg12

Dirty 30 is a guy that I wish I could like more. I know he is coming off an injury & he was playing lights out last year beforehand. But the 2nd half TD incident w/London in his face sunday really made me think about his overall approach to the game. Something's been wrong w/this defense the last couple weeks, I wonder if he's part of the problem.

He is great at making big hits, but if you watch him take on blockers he usually takes himself out of the play. His coverage issues have been talked about by us quite a bit.

Is Laron our present day Lavar? A big hitter but undisciplined? Is he a Shanahan guy? I'm actually wondering if the staff feels he's worth investing in beyond his current deal.

Yeah he's wildly inconsistent, talks way too much ish, is borderline dirty, and the years keep passing while we wait for him to be an elite safety. I don't think he's really healthy right now, but aside from the first half of last year, we have yet to see him rise to the level we hoped for when we made him a top 10 pick.

All that said, I still think we'll re-sign him. Our secondary is doggy doo doo. I know he's a liability in coverage at times, but the back 4 is worse without him.

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by GMScud

Yeah he's wildly inconsistent, talks way too much ish, is borderline dirty, and the years keep passing while we wait for him to be an elite safety. I don't think he's really healthy right now, but aside from the first half of last year, we have yet to see him rise to the level we hoped for when we made him a top 10 pick.

All that said, I still think we'll re-sign him. Our secondary is doggy doo doo. I know he's a liability in coverage at times, but the back 4 is worse without him.

To make matters worse, we don't have anyone who is really good at coverage. LL would be fine if we had at least one really good coverage corner. As it is, our coverage is pretty much smoke and mirrors with everyone back there needing to work perfectly together. We can play a defense to his strengths b/c we have no one to make up for his weaknesses.

As Matty said, however, the blame for our D isn't LL's issues - it's the lack of one really good cover guy.

[Sonny9TD]

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

To make matters worse, we don't have anyone who is really good at coverage. LL would be fine if we had at least one really good coverage corner. As it is, our coverage is pretty much smoke and mirrors with everyone back there needing to work perfectly together. We can play a defense to his strengths b/c we have no one to make up for his weaknesses.

As Matty said, however, the blame for our D isn't LL's issues - it's the lack of one really good cover guy.

He didn't say that you did. You're just kissing tail. And the reason for the defense woes is not the lack of one good cover guy. That's the reason we can't stop the run? It's a lack of discipline. Just ask London Fletcher after chewing out Laron. LOL

[JoeRedskin]

Originally Posted by Sonny9TD

He didn't say that you did. You're just kissing tail. And the reason for the defense woes is not the lack of one good cover guy. That's the reason we get ran on? LOL

I kiss nobody's tail. Matty's quote was:

Originally Posted by Mattyk

I agree. Seems a little too nit-picky to me to start singling out individuals when the unit as a whole is struggling and needs to pick it up. Seems like whenever the D struggles it's always Hall or Landry's fault.

Which indicated to me that he was not blaming LL at this point, which I agree with and with which my statement was entirely consistent.

Originally Posted by JoeRedskin

As Matty said, however, the blame for our D isn't LL's issues - it's the lack of one really good cover guy.

I should have clarified that I was speaking of the passing D - but, yes, as to that, I think that having one true cover corner would radically improve the rest of our pass defense. Right now, in our pass D, we can't take any one receiver - whether it be a WR, RB or TE - out of the game by assigning a single person to cover them. This isn't applicable to just the league's top receivers, I would suggest it is applicable to every team's top receiver. In light of that, Landry, whose coverage is based on athleticism and closing speed as opposed to anticipation and ball awareness, is forced into playing away from his strengths.

[Sonny9TD]

I should have clarified that I was speaking of the passing D - but, yes, as to that, I think that having one true cover corner would radically improve the rest of our pass defense. Right now, in our pass D, we can't take any one receiver - whether it be a WR, RB or TE - out of the game by assigning a single person to cover them. This isn't applicable to just the league's top receivers, I would suggest it is applicable to every team's top receiver. In light of that, Landry, whose coverage is based on athleticism and closing speed as opposed to anticipation and ball awareness, is forced into playing away from his strengths.[/QUOTE]

You make some good points there.

[over the mountain]

i think landrys best and quietest year was when he was assigned to be the lone deep guy who covered sideline to sideline.

i think atogwe was brought in to take over that duty and allow landry to play closer to the line.

i think atogwes absence has been a big problem.

i think landry needs to improve to be that all around beast we hoped from him but even with his certain limitations, he still one of the few younger core pieces we have.

[Defensewins]

There are guys on this defense that are playing worse then Dirty 30.
CB's Barnes and Wilson have played worse. Orakpo has been playing just to get sacks and forgets his gap responsibility in the run game. It has killed us on numerous occasions. Rookie Kerrigan is playing better thatn Orakpo and is our most consistent OLB by far. I think these three (Barnes, Wilson and Orakpo) have played worse than Landry.

[KI Skins Fan]

My biggest complaint about Landry has nothing to do with LL himself but with Redskins management. My complaint is that we could have drafted Adrian Peterson instead in the 2007 draft. AP was one of the greatest college RBs that I have seen. I wanted him badly for the Skins, but n-o-o-o-o-o!

[Ruhskins]

The defensive backs on this team appear to continue to have communication issues, and the Landry incident on Sunday is just another proof of this. Actually lack of communication seems to be an issue that has plagued our secondary for a long time. It seems to me that the coaching staff has always depended on the pass rush as a way to improve the secondary. However, Haslett and the DBs coach need to find a way to fix this communication issue so the secondary is effective when the pass rush fails.

This is why I am critical of people that go on auto-b*tch mode and focus on one guy when something bad happens. There are plenty of situation where just one guy screwed up, but often time when there has been breakdowns in our coverage it's because there was no communication between two players (example: when Buchannon left Doughty one-on-one with Andre Johnson last year in the Texans game).

[freddyg12]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

The defensive backs on this team appear to continue to have communication issues, and the Landry incident on Sunday is just another proof of this. Actually lack of communication seems to be an issue that has plagued our secondary for a long time. It seems to me that the coaching staff has always depended on the pass rush as a way to improve the secondary. However, Haslett and the DBs coach need to find a way to fix this communication issue so the secondary is effective when the pass rush fails.

This is why I am critical of people that go on auto-b*tch mode and focus on one guy when something bad happens. There are plenty of situation where just one guy screwed up, but often time when there has been breakdowns in our coverage it's because there was no communication between two players (example: when Buchannon left Doughty one-on-one with Andre Johnson last year in the Texans game).

Don't know if that's directed at me, I can see how it appears I'm blaming Landry for a bigger problem. When coaches look to address a problem, personel is obviously a major part, so I'm just pointing out that LL may be part of the problem, not the whole problem itself.

That said, Fletcher does not often single someone out so visibly. In fact, I can't recall a game in which he appeared SO pissed off at another player. That likely means that this is a recurring problem & he is taking it upon himself to single out LL.

Miscommunication in the secondary will always occur throughout any season, even w/great defenses. Players will misread plays. The problem is compounded by players, like Lavar, that continually freelance out of the system. That 1 player's attitude & play can snowball on a team. I'm just wondering if some of that is happening on this D w/Landry.

[Defensewins]

Originally Posted by freddyg12

Don't know if that's directed at me, I can see how it appears I'm blaming Landry for a bigger problem. When coaches look to address a problem, personel is obviously a major part, so I'm just pointing out that LL may be part of the problem, not the whole problem itself.

That said, Fletcher does not often single someone out so visibly. In fact, I can't recall a game in which he appeared SO pissed off at another player. That likely means that this is a recurring problem & he is taking it upon himself to single out LL.

Miscommunication in the secondary will always occur throughout any season, even w/great defenses. Players will misread plays. The problem is compounded by players, like Lavar, that continually freelance out of the system. That 1 player's attitude & play can snowball on a team. I'm just wondering if some of that is happening on this D w/Landry.

It also might mean Fletcher expects more from LL then some of the other players.
Shit rolls down hill, owner to coaches, coaches to team leaders, leaders to rest of the players. While LL is not the team leader Fletcher is, LL's level of play is expected to be top level and he is expected to one of the leaders of the secondary. A unit that happens to be under performing. I do not think Landry is the problem. Fletch is frustrated.
There are guys playing a lot worse than Landry and you do not see them getting screamed at in public.
The expectation level is higher for a Flech and LL. That is all.

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by freddyg12

Don't know if that's directed at me, I can see how it appears I'm blaming Landry for a bigger problem. When coaches look to address a problem, personel is obviously a major part, so I'm just pointing out that LL may be part of the problem, not the whole problem itself.

It really wasn't, because this is the first time this season I hear a complaint about Landry. I think though that it is a concern when a player like Landry (who is supposed to be our best player on defense) is faltering. I always hear people during games complain about either Doughty or Hall, and feel that they are the only ones screwing up. When it seems that the entire defensive backs unit is having issues, and not just one guy.

[freddyg12]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

It really wasn't, because this is the first time this season I hear a complaint about Landry. I think though that it is a concern when a player like Landry (who is supposed to be our best player on defense) is faltering. I always hear people during games complain about either Doughty or Hall, and feel that they are the only ones screwing up. When it seems that the entire defensive backs unit is having issues, and not just one guy.

As someone mentioned earlier, the expectation is greater of LL. I agree w/that & that makes sense since each player has his a different contract & thus different level of investment from the team.

I'm not just complaining about LL per se as much as I am questioning his overall value & impact. If all we do is say, this guy (e.g. Landry) is better than that guy (e.g. Barnes), there's not much interesting to debate. I'm posing the question as to whether LL is affecting the unit's chemistry. I don't know, but take a look at our results since his return.

[Sonny9TD]

Originally Posted by freddyg12

As someone mentioned earlier, the expectation is greater of LL. I agree w/that & that makes sense since each player has his a different contract & thus different level of investment from the team.

I'm not just complaining about LL per se as much as I am questioning his overall value & impact. If all we do is say, this guy (e.g. Landry) is better than that guy (e.g. Barnes), there's not much interesting to debate. I'm posing the question as to whether LL is affecting the unit's chemistry. I don't know, but take a look at our results since his return.

Not that I know everything but good point.