Roy Williams = dirty tackler

[MTK]

Did anyone notice he's still dragging people down by the collar this year? What was the point of the horse collar rule being put in to place? Portis injured his lower back when Williams yanked him down like that on the sideline, and after watching the highlights of the game I noticed Williams had at least two tackles like that on Portis.

I think they really need to look at the rule again this offseason... has anyone actually seen it called this season??

There seems to be this vague interpretation of what a horse collar actually is, I say if you grab the back of the shoulder pads around the collar area it should be a penalty, period.

What do you guys think?

[TheMalcolmConnection]

I agree. He bent Portis over backwards. That can cause some serious spinal injury.

[scowan]

I guess because I am aware of the rule, I have noticed that kind of tackling more this year than ever before. Hasn't that kind of tackling always been around, or is it a new way for guys to make a tackle? I can't remember if guys have aways tackled like that or not. I guess when you are chasing someone, you don't have a lot of options for ways to bring him down.

[djnemo65]

I know, I was furious about this. I mean, they changed the rule primarily because of the way this one guy tackles, he's doing the tackle blatantly, and they aren't calling it.

Maybe I'm confused about the exact language of the rule, but it seems like it still happens as much as ever and doesn't really seem to get called much.

[BrudLee]

The rule was created because of the injury to Terrell Owens last year by... Roy Williams. Williams also injured Tyrone Calico in a preseason game, and Musa Smith of the Ravens last year, ending his season.

I have a feeling that unless there is an injury, the rule won't be enforced. As it is written, it's OK to grab the back of the shoulder pads, you just can't yank down. That grey area allows a lot of wiggle room in the implementation of penalty. More likely, the players may be fined after games, rather than punished during them.

[mheisig]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Did anyone notice he's still dragging people down by the collar this year? What was the point of the horse collar rule being put in to place? Portis injured his lower back when Williams yanked him down like that on the sideline, and after watching the highlights of the game I noticed Williams had at least two tackles like that on Portis.

I think they really need to look at the rule again this offseason... has anyone actually seen it called this season??

There seems to be this vague interpretation of what a horse collar actually is, I say if you grab the back of the shoulder pads around the collar area it should be a penalty, period.

What do you guys think?

I agree his tackle on Portis was pretty dirty and I was waiting for the horse-collar call too. The explanation Joe Buck and Troy Aikman gave was that Williams had to grab inside Portis' shoulder pads in order for it to be a horse-collar. I guess Williams had the jersey and part of the pads but his hand wasn't actually inside.

They also said that even if the defenders hands is inside the pads that the motion has to be pretty quick - in other words if Portis drags Williams along for a few yards it isn't a penalty - Portis would have to get yanked back pretty abruptly.

Seems like alot of splitting of hairs to me...oh well, football is a rough game.

[cpayne5]

I saw a segment with Mike Pereira (NFL's head of officiating), and he explained the rule.

Two things have to happen for a flag to be thrown.
* the defender gets his hand inside of the pads
* the defender immediately yanks the offensive player down

That tackle on Portis literally happened right in front of me and I was screaming and yelling for a flag to be thrown, but the way the rule reads, it was the correct call, I'm affraid.

[5RINGS]

Originally Posted by cpayne5

I saw a segment with Mike Pereira (NFL's head of officiating), and he explained the rule.

Two things have to happen for a flag to be thrown.
* the defender gets his hand inside of the pads
* the defender immediately yanks the offensive player down

That tackle on Portis literally happened right in front of me and I was screaming and yelling for a flag to be thrown, but the way the rule reads, it was the correct call, I'm affraid.

Exactly right,

as the rule is currently written, it was not a penalty. He didn't even bend him backwards, he bent him sideways.

Whatever, did you want to win by 42 points?

[mheisig]

Originally Posted by 5RINGS

Whatever, did you want to win by 42 points?

Yes! That would have been even better!

[giacomo2]

this is just another rule that the redskins never get. if we would've done that....they probably would suspend the player. what i like is the bs reasons why they do not call the penalty, example:on monday night against the cowbitches, brunnell was horse collared, and john gay madden said the rule didn't apply to qb's. in the preseason, when a redskin got horse-collared, the anouncer said the rule only applied to the quarterback. how about the clothes-line on ramsey the first game? where was the penalty? or fine? let's face it, the redskins team is called differently, and i think it really sucks.

[BrudLee]

Originally Posted by 5RINGS

Whatever, did you want to win by 42 points?

Would you have wanted to?

[MTK]

Originally Posted by 5RINGS

Exactly right,

as the rule is currently written, it was not a penalty. He didn't even bend him backwards, he bent him sideways.

Whatever, did you want to win by 42 points?

Yes it was called correctly, I'm just debating as to whether the rule needs to be revised.

I'm concerned about seeing our franchise back being injured by a shady tackle, that's all.

Whatever happened to going for the legs or wrapping up a guy, Williams is constantly dragging people down by the collar.

[SouperMeister]

Originally Posted by 5RINGS

Exactly right,

as the rule is currently written, it was not a penalty. He didn't even bend him backwards, he bent him sideways.

Whatever, did you want to win by 42 points?

Roy Williams should try tackling the old fashioned way - by hitting and wrapping. Whether he actually grabbed the back of the shoulder pads is a moot point. The guy ALWAYS seems to be reaching for the back of the jersey collar, and had two such tackles against Tiki Barber last month at the Meadowlands. On the first, he pulled up a little, because he sensed a flag would have come had he dragged Tiki down immediately. It had always been within the rules to tackle that way, so I don't consider Williams a dirty player. That said, I see him as unsound fundamentally if he's constantly out of position to make a clean hit, and has to resort to grabbing the collar.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by SouperMeister

It had always been within the rules to tackle that way, so I don't consider Williams a dirty player.

While the tackle has always been around and legal it hasn't been prevalent and that would lead me to believe that it was sorta of an unspoken rule that it wasn't kosher and one better not try it without conisdering the likelyhood of getting one's ass handed to them in short order. I am just guessing but there are a bunch of things like this and I think it needs to move back into the the player policed rules. I consider it dirty to tackle a guy in a way that you know is very likely to cause significant injury regardless of the tackled player's ability to withstand hits. Hitting a guy at full speed head on is part of the game. The player tackling and the player being tackled take on risk and there is a good chance that no one gets hurt or that the tackler gets hurt. When you are chop blocking or horse collaring you taking no risk as a tackler and putting the other player in a very dangerous position where they could be seriously injured. Thats dirty.

[djnemo65]

Maybe we should give Roy a break. I mean, its hard having to always tackle from behind after getting burnt...