Currently Rostered Players Who Should be on the Redskins in 2011

[GTripp0012]

In the past, we've always started end of the year threads based around the idea that there are some players on the current roster who do not deserve to be back for performance reasons. This thread aims to look at the other side of that: players who have contracts beyond 2010 who should be kept on those contracts.

There will be a different time/thread to look at players on expiring contracts with four or more years of service,the following players:

Rex Grossman
Santana Moss
Jammal Brown
Stephon Heyer
Vonnie Holliday
Phillip Daniels
Kedric Golston
Chris Wilson
Rocky McIntosh
HB Blades
Carlos Rogers
Phillip Buchanon
Reed Doughty

Those 13 players have expiring contracts. I want to deal specifically with only the players who are under team control next year. Let's discuss those (not on the above list) who should be brought back under their current deals. We'll deal with our unrestricted free agents at a later date.

Pick around 10 to 12 names that you'd like to see back in DC under their current contract.

[skinsfaninok]

Hall
Orakpo
Landry
Williams
Armstrong
Torain
Banks
Fletcher (HOF In my book)
F.Davis (like to trade him though)
Cooley

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

Hall
Orakpo
Landry
Williams
Armstrong
Torain
Banks
Fletcher (HOF In my book)
F.Davis (like to trade him though)
Cooley

I agree with you that in a world of perfect knowledge, Fletcher is a hall of fame caliber linebacker. But the flawed methodology used by a lot of hall of fame voters relies heavily on pro bowls and all-pro votes. And, perhaps wrongly, Fletcher didn't collect a lot of those otherwise meaningless awards. So he won't get down to a hall of fame finalists list.

But this guy has had a fantastic career, and his consecutive starts streak is more impressive than that of any quarterback. And as far as pure effectiveness goes, he's more effective now than Brett Favre was at a similar point in his career.

[skinsfaninok]

I agree with your 20 except CP, I'm ready for him to go

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

I agree with your 20 except CP, I'm ready for him to go

It's really a CP or Torain for the RB spot for the guy who doesn't play special teams. Can't afford to roster both.

I presume most will choose Torain, based on youth, and his yard production from this season. Portis is WAY more expensive, up around $8 million for next year. But Torain also might not be a pro-back in my opinion. He has poor vision, and while I think he can get a lot better as a blocker, he's just not very good right now. He's the kind of player you want to get in the open field with the football because he doesn't waste movement, but he's more of a package player than an every down back. There's a designation for package players who don't contribute special teams, it's called "waived."

Portis is a fantastic blocker and a much better runner than Torain is. He's not nearly as good in the open field. And for $8 million, that a tough sell to keep a guy. But he can still, at age 30, be the lead back in our offensive attack. So I'd like to see him back for that reason. We're an above average offense with Clinton Portis. We're a below average offense with Ryan Torain. That, to me, is worth a $8 million price tag.

[sportscurmudgeon]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I agree with you that in a world of perfect knowledge, Fletcher is a hall of fame caliber linebacker. But the flawed methodology used by a lot of hall of fame voters relies heavily on pro bowls and all-pro votes. And, perhaps wrongly, Fletcher didn't collect a lot of those otherwise meaningless awards. So he won't get down to a hall of fame finalists list.

But this guy has had a fantastic career, and his consecutive starts streak is more impressive than that of any quarterback. And as far as pure effectiveness goes, he's more effective now than Brett Favre was at a similar point in his career.

GTripp:

The "flawed methodoloogy" also relies heavily on winning - - expeciallly when it comes to QBs on offense and MLBs on defense. Fletcher's years in Buffalo and Washington will not help his cause for the HoF - - unless he breaks Favre's record for consecutive starts.

Go look at the MLBs - - or the OLBs in a 3-4 alignment - - who are in the Hall of Fame now. Is Fletcher really as good as any of them? I don't think so...

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by sportscurmudgeon

GTripp:

The "flawed methodoloogy" also relies heavily on winning - - expeciallly when it comes to QBs on offense and MLBs on defense. Fletcher's years in Buffalo and Washington will not help his cause for the HoF - - unless he breaks Favre's record for consecutive starts.

Go look at the MLBs - - or the OLBs in a 3-4 alignment - - who are in the Hall of Fame now. Is Fletcher really as good as any of them? I don't think so...

Well, Harry Carson just went into the hall of fame. He was a 9 time pro bowler, but was never once an AP All-pro. Fletcher is going to retire with just as many All-pro selections, but the many difference between them is pro bowl selections.

That's probably more of a New York-centric bias than a measurable gap in on field contribution. It didn't hurt that Carson's teams won more...but if he played for Seattle and won just as much as he did, no one would consider him a hall of famer. Even though he's pretty deserving. Just the benefit of playing home games in New York.

[GTripp0012]

I would bring back the following 20 players on their current deals:

Kevin Barnes
LaRon Landry
London Fletcher
Brian Orakpo
Lorenzo Alexander
Anthony Bryant
Jeremy Jarmon
Ma'ake Kemoeatu
Adam Carriker
Graham Gano
Trent Williams
Kory Lichtensteiger
Will Montgomery
Chris Cooley
Fred Davis
Logan Paulsen
Anthony Armstrong
Brandon Banks
Clinton Portis
Keiland Williams

I don't want Ryan Torain guaranteed a roster spot next year, as I'd rather pay the extra $7 million to have a 30 year old Portis splitting time with a second year Keiland Williams. Torain doesn't seem to have a meaningful role on special teams, which would give him value as a third RB. But if you give him that third roster spot and let him play in front of Williams, it's poor roster management. The Shanahan's have had good success with rookies at the RB position, and I'd free up some roster spots to use on rookie runners. I know they really like Torain though.

There are guys like Rob Jackson, Perry Riley, Macho Harris, Erik Cook, and Terrence Austin who I want to see more of. I am not guaranteeing their roster spots here, but they'll get every chance to compete for a job.

Kemoeatu was not an easy inclusion on this list because he was a poor nose tackle except for a 3 game stretch in the middle of the season. But I still like his prospective value and he's only making a couple of million next year. Make no mistake, in a 3-4, Anthony Bryant is the starter at nose tackle, with Jarmon/Holliday, and Carriker on the ends. But we play a lot of 40 fronts, and Kemo gets great pressure for a guy as large as he is. That's valuable. Especially on a finesse team like the Redskins.

[Chico23231]

[QUOTE=GTripp0012;772974]I would bring back the following 20 players on their current deals:

Kevin Barnes
LaRon Landry
London Fletcher
Brian Orakpo
Lorenzo Alexander
Anthony Bryant
Jeremy Jarmon
Ma'ake Kemoeatu
Adam Carriker
Graham Gano
Trent Williams
Kory Lichtensteiger
Will Montgomery
Chris Cooley
Fred Davis
Logan Paulsen
Anthony Armstrong
Brandon Banks
Clinton Portis
Keiland Williams

Couple changes:
Guarentee stays:
Hall
Riley
Cook
Moore(just cause we zero at saftey outside of Landry, he would be depth)

Go:
Portis
Kemo
Gano

Trade:
McNabb
Albert
Cooley (if he couldnt be moved, bring him back, but its time to move on with the more athletic, faster Davis)

2 New RBs are needed with K Williams being the 3rd down back. The knock on Torrain is he is injury prone and we need guys to stay on the field. Portis is done, too many injuries. We need speed and a weapon in the backfield, we have none with our 3 guys at this point. Kemo doesnt do enough, Id like to see his roster spot with a younger guy, Bryant would work...with an overall starting upgrade at NT. Bring in someone to compete with Gano, with Gano losing out would be good. Cooley is a good player, if we could get a 3rd for him id let him go and let the only viable draft of that year move up.

[Big C]

[quote=Chico23231;773005]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I would bring back the following 20 players on their current deals:

Kevin Barnes
LaRon Landry
London Fletcher
Brian Orakpo
Lorenzo Alexander
Anthony Bryant
Jeremy Jarmon
Ma'ake Kemoeatu
Adam Carriker
Graham Gano
Trent Williams
Kory Lichtensteiger
Will Montgomery
Chris Cooley
Fred Davis
Logan Paulsen
Anthony Armstrong
Brandon Banks
Clinton Portis
Keiland Williams

Couple changes:
Guarentee stays:
Hall
Riley
Cook
Moore(just cause we zero at saftey outside of Landry, he would be depth)

Go:
Portis
Kemo
Gano

Trade:
McNabb
Albert
Cooley (if he couldnt be moved, bring him back, but its time to move on with the more athletic, faster Davis)

2 New RBs are needed with K Williams being the 3rd down back. The knock on Torrain is he is injury prone and we need guys to stay on the field. Portis is done, too many injuries. We need speed and a weapon in the backfield, we have none with our 3 guys at this point. Kemo doesnt do enough, Id like to see his roster spot with a younger guy, Bryant would work...with an overall starting upgrade at NT. Bring in someone to compete with Gano, with Gano losing out would be good. Cooley is a good player, if we could get a 3rd for him id let him go and let the only viable draft of that year move up.

everyone realizes that bryant is 29 right? its not like hes some young guy with a high ceiling or something. hes been better than kemo though, but hes not a the long term answer

[Chico23231]

[quote=Big C;773034]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

everyone realizes that bryant is 29 right? its not like hes some young guy with a high ceiling or something. hes been better than kemo though, but hes not a the long term answer

right, i like him as depth over Kemo. Ive stated all year NT should be top priority in the offseason, looks like finding a starting QB will now over take that. Our O-line and D-line both need 2 new starters for each coming into next year.

[BaltimoreSkins]

I'm kind of a pessimist when it comes to the current roster's desire to win games. I would be satisfied if they brought back:
Orakpo
Trent Williams
Fletcher
Banks
Armstrong
Cooley
Davis

[GTripp0012]

I also think a potentially shortened 2011 season benefits Portis, who will be healthy around playoff time, if we make it.

[GTripp0012]

I'll also stay this: for as fantastic as Brian Orakpo is at rushing the passer, he's not a complete player with a really high football IQ. His contributions to the team can be mostly replaced. We just have one of the best young pass rushers in the game, and need to complement him with other top pass rushers in order to get the most out of him. If teams can just double team him because we have no other pass rushing threats, he's a liability out there at linebacker.

Most of Lorenzo Alexander's skill set translated very well to outside linebacker. His pass rushing skills did not. He's an interior pass rusher playing on the outside.

[30gut]

Here's my line-up:

QB-upgrade needed John Beck
RB-Torrain, Keiland Williams, James Davis
FB-Sellers, Young
WR-Moss, Armstrong, Austin
TE-Cooley, Fred Davis (probably need to trade 1 of the 2) Paulsen
LT-Trent Williams--Stephon Heyer
LG/C-Lichtensteiger/Montgomery
RG-? upgrade needed
RT- upgrade needed

Defense-
ILBs-Fletcher, Riley, Blades, Henson
ROLB-Orakpo, Andre Carter, Rob Jackson, Chris Wilson (the fact that they don't ever play him and gave Rob Jackson more reps then Wilson makes me wonder)
LOLB-?? Alexander-upgrade needed--move a ROLB over LOLB??
NT-Bryant--depth or upgrade needed
RDE-upgrade needed
LDE-Carriker
CBs-Hall, Rogers, Buchanon, Barnes,Westbrook
FS-Landry, Barnes, Moore, Macho Harris
SS-Doughty, Horton, Moore, Barnes