Disappointed with Gardner

[MTK]

As I was drifting off to sleep last night I was thinking how disappointing Rod Gardner has been that we've reached the point where we're looking to deal him and move on.

Don't get me wrong, I think the time has come to move on, but at the same time it's just disappointing. I remember in his rookie year when he had that 200+ day against the Panthers, and it seemed like we just might have a damn good WR on our hands. And when he went over 1000 yards in his second season and scored 8 TD's, I really thought we had ourselves a keeper.

We've all seen those games from him where he flashes the ability to take over and dominate, only to have him follow up the next week with 4 catches for 40 yards.

The time has come to move on, but I can't help but feel a bit cheated by Rod Gardner. The guy has the talent to be a very good WR in this league, what is holding him back is beyond me. Maybe a lack of focus or dedication? Or maybe he's just not that good and he really is just a 50 catch per season kind of WR who's going to tease you one week and disappoint the next.

I hope the change of scenery does him good, but I really think the only thing that's truly going to benefit him is a commitment from within himself to improve. That's why I'm really disappointed in RG, the guy has the skills, something obviously is missing in his preperation and focus, and that's nobody's fault but his own.

[Redskins_P]

I was watching the Tampa game w/ my cousin over the weekend and whats funny is that the first pass thrown to Gardner (quick screen) was dropped. I mean, I know Brunell was throwing the pass, but the damn thing hit him right in between the number and he simply dropped it. He then followed w/ 4 drops in the game.

I seriously think it's lack of concentration.......


Oh yeah, that was also one of the most prettiest passes Brunell had all year. He had zip on the ball and it was an accurate throw.

[Schneed10]

I'm especially disappointed because the Redskins passed up on Santana Moss in that draft and selected Gardner instead. Moss had a tough year this year, but he certainly was great last year and finished strong this season. Some of this year's struggles have to be attributable to Pennington's torn rotator cuff. I wish we had come away with Moss that day. I remember thinking why the heck would you pass up Moss for Rod Gardner that day. I suppose the allure of Gardner's size was appealing; but at some point you just need to take the guy who gets it done. I'm glad Gibbs has the team on the right track when it comes to drafts now.

[Redskins_P]

Gardner is one of the few Schottenheimer picks that never panned out.......

[FRPLG]

If we were looking or a quality possession type guy I would want Gardner to stick with us. With some dedication he could be a great possession receiver in the mold of Keyshawn just better and without so much of the attitude. Problem is that I don't think he fits what we want to do even then. We're not a dink and dump team really. I know we threw countless WR screens and such but most of those were to Coles and are meant to be long handoffs to get the ball in the hands of our fastest most athletic WR so he can make one guy miss and break a big gainer. I think the true untapped potential in the offense is downfield where I cannot honetly remember Gardner ever being factor in his career. In fact I can vividly remember countless downfield jumpers thrown during Spurrier's reign that ended up with Gardner just being the defender rather han him getting position to catch the ball. He is a possession type guy because he seems to lack the speed to get past people and the discipline to use his body correctly to make seperation. So, seeing as how he is "50-50", that is not good for a possession receiver. I also think he has loads of talent and I am disappointed too in what he has given us. I don't question his work ethic or his motivation I just question his mental ability to perform at a high level with focus and determination. That being said I think at his best he still would not be the field stretcher that we need. When you look at the best WRs in the game you notice a few things. Most have game speed, and most have size. Moss and TO are the prime examples. Both are giant and bot can run like damn gazelles with the pads on. We're not talking sprint speed, we're talking game speed and both are among the fastest game speed players at WR. Both also use their bodies well for position since they are so big(this is one of the reason they seem to play at afaster game speed than their straight away speed would indicate). If you look at this years receivers you really only see one or two guys who ahve this potential. Edwards(who will be gone when we pick) and Williams. Williams isn't a burner but he consistently beat faster(straight away speed) CBs at USC. We're talking about good CBs too. HE seems to play at a faster game speed and to me he just exudes that feeling that he is going to be the stud of the draft when we look back in 4 or 5 years. We HAVE to take him at 9 if he is there unless we think we can trade down and get him still.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

I'm especially disappointed because the Redskins passed up on Santana Moss in that draft and selected Gardner instead. Moss had a tough year this year, but he certainly was great last year and finished strong this season. Some of this year's struggles have to be attributable to Pennington's torn rotator cuff. I wish we had come away with Moss that day. I remember thinking why the heck would you pass up Moss for Rod Gardner that day. I suppose the allure of Gardner's size was appealing; but at some point you just need to take the guy who gets it done. I'm glad Gibbs has the team on the right track when it comes to drafts now.

Funny you mention that because as I recall Dan Snyder was very high on Moss and if it was up to him we'd probably have him right now.

Instead Marty had the power in that draft and made the Rod Gardner selection, opting for the bigger and more physical target.

[dirtbag2112]

Gardner could be traded to the Dolphins and go on to be great just like every other slightly-above-average-ex-redskin.

[saden1]

How is Santana Moss better than Rod Gardner again? I'm just wondering, that's all.

[Redskins_P]

Originally Posted by saden1

How is Santana Moss better than Rod Gardner again? I'm just wondering, that's all.

I think Moss has more playmaking ability than Gardner. And I would like to see who has more drops. I bet Gardner does.....

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by saden1

How is Santana Moss better than Rod Gardner again? I'm just wondering, that's all.

Santana Moss's Best Year: In 2003, 73 Receptions, 1105 Yards, 10 TDs.
Rod Gardner's Best Year: In 2002, 71 Receptions, 1006 Yards, 8 TDs.

Looks pretty equal on the surface, until you consider that Santana Moss averaged 10 Yards per punt return in 2003, and 8 Yards per punt return in 2004.

Gardner's 2003 and 2004 seasons were dismal, 59 catches for 600 yards, and 51 catches for 650 yards respectively. Santana Moss in 2004 had 45 catches for 838 yards, which on the surface again looks unspectacular, except he was among the league leaders in Yards Per Catch with 18.9. Which of course attests to his big-play ability. Plus, he managed to do all of that with Pennington dealing with a torn rotator cuff, inhibiting his ability to go deep.

Beyond the stats, Moss is just much more consistent. Gardner drops balls, as we've all seen and yelled at our TVs about. Those drops are what kill drives and cause you to punt.

I'd much rather have Moss.

[MTK]

Moss is definitely the more dynamic playmaker. He was hampered by injuries and less than stellar QB play this year. I would take him over RG in a second.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Santana Moss's Best Year: In 2003, 73 Receptions, 1105 Yards, 10 TDs.
Rod Gardner's Best Year: In 2002, 71 Receptions, 1006 Yards, 8 TDs.

Looks pretty equal on the surface, until you consider that Santana Moss averaged 10 Yards per punt return in 2003, and 8 Yards per punt return in 2004.

Gardner's 2003 and 2004 seasons were dismal, 59 catches for 600 yards, and 51 catches for 650 yards respectively. Santana Moss in 2004 had 45 catches for 838 yards, which on the surface again looks unspectacular, except he was among the league leaders in Yards Per Catch with 18.9. Which of course attests to his big-play ability. Plus, he managed to do all of that with Pennington dealing with a torn rotator cuff, inhibiting his ability to go deep.

Beyond the stats, Moss is just much more consistent. Gardner drops balls, as we've all seen and yelled at our TVs about. Those drops are what kill drives and cause you to punt.

I'd much rather have Moss.

Name one Redskin who had a good year during the 2002-2003 season. Even Coles' numbers were down.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by saden1

Name one Redskin who had a good year during the 2002-2003 season. Even Coles' numbers were down.

That's not an excuse, Gardner was a reason why the passing game couldn't attack downfield. There's a reason the coaching staff didn't throw deep very often, and it's not because they suddenly forgot how to call deep passing plays. It's because:
1) Coles' toe was enough of a hinderance that he couldn't go deep, he could only serve as a possession type guy. And he got much better once he got that cortisone shot in the toe.
2) Brunell didn't show enough arm strength to throw deep while he was playing.
3) Gardner was so inconsistent that Gibbs didn't feel comfortable relying on him for big plays. He dropped so many passes that he just couldn't be trusted. We all know Gibbs is big on dependability and not making mistakes. Gardner is clearly not his guy.

Santana Moss doesn't drop passes, and he's a much faster deep threat. You can't seriously tell me you'd rather have Gardner than Moss?

[MTK]

Coles was in NY for the '02-'03 season

[saden1]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Coles was in NY for the '02-'03 season

i meant 2003-2004.