[mlmpetert]

Originally Posted by skinsguy

My point is, the government is going about this the wrong way. You people who are still arguing hot and heavy in favor of gay marriage are still supporting discrimination, because you have flat out ignored those loving couples who have children together but are not married nor believe in marriage, yet have a loving home together. Should they be left out in the dark as well? Might I add that not all of the states in the union recognize a couple living together for so many years as being legally married. At least that isn't the case in NC. But, my point is, I have not heard any of the high and mighty here be a voice for any of those people either!

The thing is, the arugment has gone into a polarizing way where you're a homophobe if you don't agree with homosexuality, or your ignorant or whatever. You're just as ignorant for trying to down people's beliefs and belittling them in hopes of changing their views. That's a third grade way of going about doing things. It's just as intolerant. There would be absolutely no argument from either side if the government stayed out the marriage business like it should. If it was so gun-ho on giving benefits to couples who could procreate or wanting to adopt, then it should have just left it at that - benefits to those who are living together and have children together either through natural means or adoption. That way, nobody is left out. But, people will continue to argue and fight the wrong fight, and as long as it's about trying to convince somebody that their views are right or wrong, this country will never get passed this issue.

Very well said. I took out the first part though because its not really state sponsored benefits, at least in my research and opinion.

I tried a while back to see why government, and in particular the federal government, became involved in marriage in the first place. As best as I can tell it deals with basic record keeping by individual states followed by federal law for property/ownership rights relating to women (back when women didn’t have many rights) and for federal taxation of income and property. And finally for welfare entitlements starting in the 30’s.

Im nearly certain initial “dependency” type elections (your spouse is on your employer’s healthcare plan) all initially originated by goodwill from private corporations, much like how some corporations are starting to offer dependency rights for gay couples now-a-days. However, at some point initial goodwill morphed into public policy and became enforceable via federal law.

So now you have certain “rights” but more appropriately these things should be called certain laws/restrictions and penalties governing traditional marriage.

So to me the issue isn’t that gay people cant get married to the person they love, its that in order to be subjected to certain rights/laws/restrictions/penalties we have to get married. But on top of that marriage is defined in a way to specifically exclude certain people/groups.

Ive mentioned here before that I think gays being denied the ability to have marriage laws imposed on their relationships is the biggest civil rights issue of our day. However, I think im changing my opinion. We should all have the right to elect “Traditional Marriage” laws be imposed on any type of relationship we are involved in with another competent adult(s). We should also be free to not elect those “rights”

Skinsguy you are so right in the unfairness couples face who choose not to wed which deny them from certain rules imposed on their relationship. Everyone should be able to elect the same set of rules for their relationship. It should be without restriction but otherwise left as it is now; as a purely contractual legal matter.

The only issue with all this is that the certain rights/laws/restrictions/penalties all need to be modified. They were created for a specific set of principals and if those principles change you need to change these certain rights/laws/restrictions/penalties.