Running game will be vastly improved
 

With all the talk of receivers and defense, a commonly overlooked element of next year's offense will be our much improved running attack and O-Line. Portis will have a year under his belt in Gibb's running scheme and I think the addition of Casey Rabach will have a bigger impact than a lot of folks think. Jansen's return and Samuels having another year under Buges means our tackle spot is set. Randy Thomas is a stud at RG and Dockery and Ray Brown will be ok at LG. Plus we now have depth with Molinaro and Wilson. Anyone have any reason to believe our "Dirtbags" won't be a great line this year? I'm pretty excited about them.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

[QUOTE=dblanch66]With all the talk of receivers and defense, a commonly overlooked element of next year's offense will be our much improved running attack and O-Line. Portis will have a year under his belt in Gibb's running scheme and I think the addition of Casey Rabach will have a bigger impact than a lot of folks think. Jansen's return and Samuels having another year under Buges means our tackle spot is set. Randy Thomas is a stud at RG and Dockery and Ray Brown will be ok at LG. Plus we now have depth with Molinaro and Wilson. Anyone have any reason to believe our "Dirtbags" won't be a great line this year? I'm pretty excited about them.[/QUOTE]


Great? they were horrible last year, Rabach is a nice signing he's nothing spectacular, Jansen will obviously help, but it's not like Portis needed a year to learn how to run, were talking a RB here not a QB, bottom line the mere mention of Brown on our line pretty much say's it all we will have a 42 year old backing up our guard's and tackles, we can be decent but I don't see greatness with that line.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

Our running game will be better once we stop pretending we have John Riggins in the game. The second we start working it for Portis's fortes the sooner we start seeing big results.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

That's my point. Portis had 1,315 yards last year with a patchwork line.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

He also had among the lowest YPC in the NFL. What's your point?

Fact is Portis is a stud, but not for the power running game. It's not the line as much as the system.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

I guess I'm just optimistic because if he can gain over 1300 yards with a sub-par line and IF the coaching staff adusts a little to CP's style this year, I like the chances for an improved running game.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

If they can let him pick his holes and use his speed then our running game could be amazing.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

I believe that our offense as a whole will be better this season. Hopfully Portis can stay healthy and take advantage of it, after all we are playing against his favorite division this year, AFC WEST!!!!

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

[QUOTE=dblanch66]I guess I'm just optimistic because if he can gain over 1300 yards with a sub-par line and IF the coaching staff adusts a little to CP's style this year, I like the chances for an improved running game.[/QUOTE]


That's a big IF, I was saying that the day I heard we may trade for the guy, and yet the coaches not only didn't see it, they ran him as Daseal said like Gibbs thought he was Riggins, without doing much in the area of changing the blocking schemes to suit Portis's running style, 1300 yds? And Gibb's took 2 years off his NFL life to get there, he dropped over 1 and a half yards per carry under his career average, and couldn't get the big yard on third or fourth and 1 if his life depended on it. 1300 yards for Portis is like a QB who throws for 300 yards with 60 pass attempts for 5 yards a pop, 300 yards sounds good until you see what he had to do to get there.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

still doesn't mean we won't be better this year. Last year is over.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

From what I recall of watching the Redskins' running attack over the course of the season, Gibbs did install running plays that involved zone blocking, and Portis responded pretty well to that, since it was similar to what he excelled with in Denver. However, Gibbs never went totally in that direction, preferring to maintain a balance of zone-blocking and the trap-blocking, power-running style that brought him so much success in his previous stint.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

GOOD points, and you are correct, the return of injured players on both sides of the ball will seem like a new and much improved team!

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

I think the line does have the potential to be very good. Jansen and Samuels are a great tackle tandem, Randy Thomas is one of the more underrated guards around, and Rabach should solidify the middle. Our only question mark is at left guard. Will Dockery finally blossom?

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

I think our line will be decent this year, barring any devastating injuries like Jansen last year. Rabach is a really good center. And i think his addition to this club has been vastly underated due to all the usual skins drama in the offseason. Plus its buges..i believe he can shape up these guys and give patrick the time he needs and let portis have the holes he needs. DOnt forget that mst of the seasons other teams dfenses were stacked against the run, due to our aenemic passing game. Randy thomas is an excellent run blocker.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

I'm crossing my fingers for a "safe" preseason.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

i think we all are. unless its brunell that goes down...i dont think most people will mind that...or jimoh.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

Lay off Jimoh or "The Ade Jimoh Fan Club" will come and kick your ass...

Speaking of which, I haven't seen him lately.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

Lmao..oh well..you cant blame me for hating on him.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

With the running game, you can't point to Portis's 1300 yards and say he had a good year, he didn't. He led the league in carries. If you keep feeding him the ball, of course he's going to rack up a good yardage total. But that doesn't mean he was getting the chunks of yards that you need to gain first downs. You have to look at his yards per rush, which was 3.8, ranked at the bottom of the league.

I do think we'll be better though. Jansen coming back is a big reason. Raymer was not athletic enough to pull effectively in Gibbs' trap system. He couldn't get to his blocks fast enough and LBs were filling holes, giving Portis nowhere to go and no way to get his speed cranking. Rabach is much more athletic, I think he'll get out on blocks better.

The biggest reason for improvement, in my mind, is going to be 3rd and one's and goalline runs. Walter Rasby was supposed to be our bulldozing TE. What'd he do? Got cut midseason. We had no help for bulldozing blocking at TE or H-Back. I love Cooley, and he's a solid blocker, but he won't run guys over. I'm excited to see what White and Broughton can do. Plug them in for those short yardage situations and just run behind them, I'll bet they can move some bodies.

A running game is all about keeping the chains moving, especially in Gibbs' ball-control offense. I think we have some pieces to get that done now.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

Exactly AND not to mention Gibbs finally figured out some good schemes for Portis towards the end of the season. Even though when I posted the stats for Portis's average YPC in the second half of the season it was lower, his average against teams NOT Philadelphia and Pittsburgh was much higher. He WAS getting his chunks of yardage AND he was catching the ball out of the backfield.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

[QUOTE=Schneed10]With the running game, you can't point to Portis's 1300 yards and say he had a good year, he didn't. He led the league in carries. If you keep feeding him the ball, of course he's going to rack up a good yardage total. But that doesn't mean he was getting the chunks of yards that you need to gain first downs. You have to look at his yards per rush, which was 3.8, ranked at the bottom of the league.

I do think we'll be better though. Jansen coming back is a big reason. Raymer was not athletic enough to pull effectively in Gibbs' trap system. He couldn't get to his blocks fast enough and LBs were filling holes, giving Portis nowhere to go and no way to get his speed cranking. Rabach is much more athletic, I think he'll get out on blocks better.

The biggest reason for improvement, in my mind, is going to be 3rd and one's and goalline runs. Walter Rasby was supposed to be our bulldozing TE. What'd he do? Got cut midseason. We had no help for bulldozing blocking at TE or H-Back. I love Cooley, and he's a solid blocker, but he won't run guys over. I'm excited to see what White and Broughton can do. Plug them in for those short yardage situations and just run behind them, I'll bet they can move some bodies.

A running game is all about keeping the chains moving, especially in Gibbs' ball-control offense. I think we have some pieces to get that done now.[/QUOTE]
Where do you get your information? Portis did not lead the league in carries. Portis had 343 carries, I am pretty sure that Curtis Martin led the league with 371 carries. Yeah Portis did only have 3.8 yards per carrie, but no one can say that it was all his fault he did what Gibbs wanted him to do.

Also if you look, Portis had a very comparable season to LaDainian Tomlinson last season. The big difference in TD's but in Portis' defense this was a totaly new system and our offense didnt have much of a passing attack...

[url]http://www.nfl.com/stats/leaders/NFL/RYDS/2004/regular[/url]

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

I would agree with anyone that says Portis did not have a great year. We all DO know he is a great back and will be a stud for us given that we have good blocking and good schemes for him now.

No one is blaming him, but the fact is undeniable that he wasn't at his best last year.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

[QUOTE=TheMalcolmConnection]I would agree with anyone that says Portis did not have a great year. We all DO know he is a great back and will be a stud for us given that we have good blocking and good schemes for him now.

No one is blaming him, but the fact is undeniable that he wasn't at his best last year.[/QUOTE]
Ok, he wasnt at his best, but how many teams really feared the strong arm of Mark Brunell for the first 8 or 9 games? How much respect did Ramsey get when he took over? Also our WR's did not help it much with there amazing ability to drop the ball when we needed a first down.

To put the blame squarly on Portis is just wrong, but that is my opinion...

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

[QUOTE=Redskins8588]Ok, he wasnt at his best, but how many teams really feared the strong arm of Mark Brunell for the first 8 or 9 games? How much respect did Ramsey get when he took over? Also our WR's did not help it much with there amazing ability to drop the ball when we needed a first down.

To put the blame squarly on Portis is just wrong, but that is my opinion...[/QUOTE]


I agree. If we had a decent passing game, Portis would've done much better.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

Portis in '05....2000+ yards 400+receiving

...it's nice to dream...

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

Just in case I've been misunderstood, I'm not putting the blame on him whatsoever. He definitely did his job and did what he was asked to do.

Simply stating the fact... :)

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

[QUOTE=Redskins8588]Ok, he wasnt at his best, but how many teams really feared the strong arm of Mark Brunell for the first 8 or 9 games? How much respect did Ramsey get when he took over? Also our WR's did not help it much with there amazing ability to drop the ball when we needed a first down.

To put the blame squarly on Portis is just wrong, but that is my opinion...[/QUOTE]

Yeah you're definitely right here. When I said Portis led the league in carries, that wasn't meant to be taken literally, which is my fault for not making that clear. The point I was trying to make was "no crap Portis racked up 1300 yards, he practically led the league in carries, so if he didn't rack up a good yardage total, that'd be pretty sad."

But that's not Portis's fault. Portis didn't all of a sudden become a worse RB when he came over from Denver. His talent is still there, the line and Gibbs' blocking schemes weren't as good as Denver's.

If you read my posts, you'll see that I'm arguing that the whole reason the running game will be better is because of blocking improvements. I never mention Portis as the problem, his 3.8 yards per carry is an indicator of the line's play more than his own. With Jansen, Rabach, and the new FBs, I think the running game will get better.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

[QUOTE=Schneed10]Yeah you're definitely right here. When I said Portis led the league in carries, that wasn't meant to be taken literally, which is my fault for not making that clear. The point I was trying to make was "no crap Portis racked up 1300 yards, he practically led the league in carries, so if he didn't rack up a good yardage total, that'd be pretty sad."

But that's not Portis's fault. Portis didn't all of a sudden become a worse RB when he came over from Denver. His talent is still there, the line and Gibbs' blocking schemes weren't as good as Denver's.

If you read my posts, you'll see that I'm arguing that the whole reason the running game will be better is because of blocking improvements. I never mention Portis as the problem, his 3.8 yards per carry is an indicator of the line's play more than his own. With Jansen, Rabach, and the new FBs, I think the running game will get better.[/QUOTE]
I hope that you are right, I am really looking forward to this season with our line having Jansen back and finally a center that hopfully wont get pushed around. Sorry for the confusion, but it does kinda get to me when people act as if Portis is the main culprit to our dismal offense last season...

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

[QUOTE=Redskins8588]I hope that you are right, I am really looking forward to this season with our line having Jansen back and finally a center that hopfully wont get pushed around. Sorry for the confusion, but it does kinda get to me when people act as if Portis is the main culprit to our dismal offense last season...[/QUOTE]

Yeah I agree with you there. Portis, in my opinion, was the best offensive player we had last year by far. He willingly took pounding after pounding against 8-man fronts, carrying the ball way more times than he ever did before. He was our only offensive threat and he did his best to carry the load. We really can't expect any more than what he gave us last year, unless we put better blockers up front, better blocking schemes, and a better passing game around him. Portis is awesome for sure, but last year was a reminder that football is the ultimate team game, it takes a whole team to have a great running game.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

You guys are never satisfied. :oink:

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

You can point your finger at the line, running back, new system but the real problem was the lack of respect for our passing game. Teams stacked the line and every team will have problems running the ball when your opponents can stack the line on allmost every play except obvious pass plays.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

Agreed. I'm hoping that Gibbs' system last year was a response to injuries to the line and sub-par QB play. If this was the case, then this year our offense could be significantly improved. BUT, it may be that Gibbs really does want to stick with the system he had in place last year, in which case we'll suck mightily again.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

[QUOTE=firstdown]You can point your finger at the line, running back, new system but the real problem was the lack of respect for our passing game. Teams stacked the line and every team will have problems running the ball when your opponents can stack the line on almost every play except obvious pass plays.[/QUOTE]

Agreed, Which bring's us back to square one, will Gibbs do what's neccassary to make the offense work? You don't neccassarily have to throw, but the team your playing needs to know that if they don't respect the pass you will burn them with the pass, which in turn will keep them from stacking the box. and help open up the running game, in Gibbs first tenure teams new late in the game they were going to get a heavy dose of Riggins, but they also knew if they overcommitted to stop him we would play action and burn them with the pass, that fear kept them from stacking tha box like teams did last year.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

[QUOTE=offiss]Agreed, Which bring's us back to square one, will Gibbs do what's neccassary to make the offense work? You don't neccassarily have to throw, but the team your playing needs to know that if they don't respect the pass you will burn them with the pass, which in turn will keep them from stacking the box. and help open up the running game, in Gibbs first tenure teams new late in the game they were going to get a heavy dose of Riggins, but they also knew if they overcommitted to stop him we would play action and burn them with the pass, that fear kept them from stacking tha box like teams did last year.[/QUOTE]In Gibbs past he was a great second half coach and did a great job of adjusting. Hopefuly he is also a great second year coach and makes those needed adjustment. We can only believe that Gibbs is working long hours studying film and learning from his past mastakes.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

Hhhmm...with the talk of the offensive line, and those backing up the OL, I understand that the Redskins signed some undrafted players from the rookie minicap. Now, this by no means suggests they'll make the team, but a couple of those guys were offensive linemen. If they continue to impress, we might have some good young players who can add depth to our OL - maybe not rely on the 42 year old Ray Brown!

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

[QUOTE=TheMalcolmConnection]I would agree with anyone that says Portis did not have a great year. We all DO know he is a great back and will be a stud for us given that we have good blocking and good schemes for him now.

No one is blaming him, but the fact is undeniable that he wasn't at his best last year.[/QUOTE]



i tend to disagree with you. when you think about how pathetic the skins offense was last year, with bad line play, bad wr play, bad qb play and the oppossing defense game planning on stopping the run. in my opinion, portis had a pretty darn good year.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

if the skins can have even a decent passing game this season portis should really explode fo some big ganes.

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

I'm in the optomistic camp on this one. I love having a healthier (Jansen) and improved (Rabach) line with a second year under the master (Bugel). I also think that while we may have downgraded in overall quality of WR (Coles v. Moss), the WRs we have now can better stretch the field and back the safeties up. Coles is a better WR, but he's not faster than Moss. And Patten adds a lot more speed on the other side than Gardner was going to give you last year (remains to be seen where we line him up this year). Final piece of the puzzle is having Ramsey as the starting QB from game 1 on, who has a much stronger arm than Brunell. It's been said a million times, but as long as Gibbs isn't afraid to open it up a little downfield, I think the running game could see a huge improvement over last year. I'm really starting to get excited for the season to start!

Re: Running game will be vastly improved
 

You're just now STARTING to get excited... ;)

I was excited right after the Super Bowl.