Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

Sad Story... I always imagined Payton being a squeaky clean guy.. .I guess we all have our baggage.

Still one of my favorite players, I hope the book doesn't diminish his legacy at all.

[url=http://espn.go.com/chicago/nfl/story/_/id/7031006/chicago-bears-walter-payton-used-drugs-talked-suicide-according-book]Chicago Bears' Walter Payton used drugs, talked suicide, according to book - ESPN Chicago[/url]

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

18 games! 18 games! 18 games! "Our fans are excited about the prospect of an 18 game season."

Seriously how did the owners with a database full of cases similar to this ever consider putting together an 18 game season? Limiting head shots only does so much, I mean it helps but you'll still get terrible cases like this where guys basically become different people due to head trauma and addiction.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[quote=Gmanc711;842050]Sad Story... I always imagined Payton being a squeaky clean guy.. .I guess we all have our baggage.

Still one of my favorite players, I hope the book doesn't diminish his legacy at all.

[URL="http://espn.go.com/chicago/nfl/story/_/id/7031006/chicago-bears-walter-payton-used-drugs-talked-suicide-according-book"]Chicago Bears' Walter Payton used drugs, talked suicide, according to book - ESPN Chicago[/URL][/quote]

Apparently the book discusses how he used to have multiple girlfriends, and even had to juggle time with a girlfriend and his wife at his HOF induction.

I guess he got Vicodin from multiple dentists by lying about aching teeth. One time the police even visited his house because he was going from pharmacy to pharmacy having prescriptions filled. Pollin and Czaben were talking about the book on the Sports Reporters about an hour ago.

It's too bad because he was such a fantastic player. Hard to fault the guy for the pain medication. He took an absolute pounding during his career.

I'm in the same boat as you- I hope this doesn't tarnish his image.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

TMI, I don't want to know any of this stuff. I just want to remember the great player.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

I wish I had been around when he was tearing up defenses, but I've seen his highlights and it's a shame this book only focuses on the other side of his legacy. This is just another story that shows the dark side these guys go through during and after their playing days. At least he's in a better place now. And I completely agree Dirtbag, even just pondering the idea of an 18 game season shows how clueless these owners are.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

Do we know he became a different person because of head trauma? I'm not trying to be rude. But he could have been a suicidal cheater before the game of football. I'm curious if the book made a correlation?

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

I dont give a rats ass whats in that book, he was theee best running, blocking, pass catching, and whatever the hell else was asked of him running back i ever saw play. Thats all i have to say on this topic.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

One of my all time favs. I don't think this hurts his legacy, at least not for me, if anything it shows the guy was human and had his issues just like everyone else. On the field the guy was an absolute beast.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

Folks get so emotionally attached to players yet we don't really know who they are off the playing field.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[quote=Mattyk;842148]One of my all time favs. I don't think this hurts his legacy, at least not for me, if anything it shows the guy was human and had his issues just like everyone else. On the field the guy was an absolute beast.[/quote]

true dat, remember when Jim Brown basically called Franco Harris a pussy for runnin out of bounds? He said he admired Payton though.

plus he was classy all the way, played on sucky teams in the 70s & waited to be a part of a super bowl. Even gave up the spotlight in the backfield to the Fridge (speakin of former players w/problems).

I don't ever remember him promoting himself, his image just happened to be "squeaky clean" by the way he carried himself. More than anything to me, this shows how much the media coverage (which we consume like mad) has changed athletes' public image & privacy.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;842110]TMI, I don't want to know any of this stuff. I just want to remember the great player.[/quote]

I agree. No reason to put out all this BS after the guy dies. Payton was and will be one of my all time favorite players ever. One of the best football players ever to step on to a field.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

He could do it all on the field, run with power, run with speed, catch, block, even throw.

He was also the main reason I checked off organ donor on my license.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;842110]TMI, I don't want to know any of this stuff. I just want to remember the great player.[/quote]

Agree, this TMZ sh*t is garbage. Guess thats what you gotta do to sell books and make a dollar off the back off a flat out hero to maybe millions. Well guess this is the culture we created, this country is great isnt it.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

The book is about his entire life, and his entire life includes these things. I learned long ago to separate the player on the field from the person off the field. You kind of have to. Because of my job I know a lot that others here probably don't about a lot of today's (and yesterday's) athletes that not much surprises me (and I know so little really) but this Walter Payton news is kind of stunning though, perhaps as much as Kirby Puckett

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;842056]18 games! 18 games! 18 games! "Our fans are excited about the prospect of an 18 game season."

Seriously how did the owners with a database full of cases similar to this ever consider putting together an 18 game season? Limiting head shots only does so much, I mean it helps but you'll still get terrible cases like this where guys basically become different people due to head trauma and addiction.[/quote]

Owners don't give a shit about players health (long term). They really don't. They care about dollar signs and that's all they will continue to care about.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

All I know is Walter was one of my all time favorites. The guy played with the worst OL line for years and still rushed for thousands of yards, punished defenses finishing runs. Obviously that took it's toll. Sad story.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

I think this story is sad, but not as horrible as people hype it up to be. Life is tough folks. People have affairs, broken marriages, abuse drugs and go through some deep lows. The society we live in today has some major issues and Payton isn't the first to go through them. If anything, we should use this story as lesson that money and success isn't going to solve anything.

I think the sad part is the affect of injuries and continuous pounding. The NFL hasn't done a great job helping their vets, in general. So whenever the "No Fun League" actually has initiatives to prevent these kinds of occurrences (ex.penalties and fines for hits) I support it. For those that claim the game is changing and it won't be what it once was, I agree. We will have less stories of players in perpetual pain abusing drugs....

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

Not to derail this thread, but even with an 18 game season the plan is for the number of games to remain the same. 2 preseason and 18 regular, as opposed to the current 4 preseason and 18 regular. So this repeated argument at least one of you here has about adding two games doesn't really fly

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[quote=hooskins;842174][B]I think this story is sad, but not as horrible as people hype it up to be.[/B] Life is tough folks. People have affairs, broken marriages, abuse drugs and go through some deep lows. The society we live in today has some major issues and Payton isn't the first to go through them. If anything, we should use this story as lesson that money and success isn't going to solve anything.

I think the sad part is the affect of injuries and continuous pounding. The NFL hasn't done a great job helping their vets, in general. So whenever the "No Fun League" actually has initiatives to prevent these kinds of occurrences (ex.penalties and fines for hits) I support it. For those that claim the game is changing and it won't be what it once was, I agree. We will have less stories of players in perpetual pain abusing drugs....[/quote]

It's just surprising. It's like if we find out in 10 years that Peyton Manning had these kinds of problems.

WP had a pretty clean image prior to this news.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[quote=freddyg12;842151]true dat, remember when Jim Brown basically called Franco Harris a pussy for runnin out of bounds? He said he admired Payton though.

plus he was classy all the way, played on sucky teams in the 70s & waited to be a part of a super bowl. Even gave up the spotlight in the backfield to the Fridge (speakin of former players w/problems).

I don't ever remember him promoting himself, his image just happened to be "squeaky clean" by the way he carried himself. More than anything to me, this shows how much the media coverage (which we consume like mad) has changed athletes' public image & privacy.[/quote]

If Jim Brown thought Franco was a puss for running out of bounds i wonder what he thought about all of Emmitt Smiths fetile position plays along with running out of bounds... hmmmm.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

He was a great RB. Too bad he couldn't have enjoyed it more. RIP Walter.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[QUOTE=hooskins;842174]I think this story is sad, but not as horrible as people hype it up to be. Life is tough folks. People have affairs, broken marriages, abuse drugs and go through some deep lows. The society we live in today has some major issues and Payton isn't the first to go through them. If anything, we should use this story as lesson that money and success isn't going to solve anything.

I think the sad part is the affect of injuries and continuous pounding. The NFL hasn't done a great job helping their vets, in general[B]. So whenever the "No Fun League" actually has initiatives to prevent these kinds of occurrences (ex.penalties and fines for hits) I support it. For those that claim the game is changing and it won't be what it once was, I agree. We will have less stories of players in perpetual pain abusing drugs....[/[/B]QUOTE]

In this instance I think Walter just had an addiction. He could've done many other things to off set the pounding he took. He choose to play balls to the ball. I admire him for it, but let's not go trying to change a gladiator sport and try and micro manage it to death.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[quote=SmootSmack;842179]Not to derail this thread, but even with an 18 game season the plan is for the number of games to remain the same. 2 preseason and 18 regular, as opposed to the current 4 preseason and 18 regular. So this repeated argument at least one of you here has about adding two games doesn't really fly[/quote]


Then maybe you should look at it as minutes played in a season or potential minutes played because you really don't know when they will be subbed and how long offense/defense will be on the field.

[B]Current minutes played by a starter baring injury and if they played every down. [/B]

16 x 60 = 960 regular season potential minutes
4 x 30 = 120 pre season potential minutes (this is assuming they play just half the game in pre-season, it is probable less then that)

Current total potential minutes played 1080

[B]18 game season [/B]

18x 60 = 1080 regular season potential minutes
2 x 30 = 60 pre-season potential minutes (they actual may play more then a half in this format since they only have 2 games to beef up)

18 game schedule total potential minutes played by a starter 1140

That gives you a delta of 60 potential more minutes (a whole game) a starter would be playing (potential for injury) in the 18 game season.


If you are full time player in the NFL you will definitely see more playing time in the 18 game format then you would in the 16 game format.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[quote=SmootSmack;842179]Not to derail this thread, but even with an 18 game season the plan is for the number of games to remain the same. 2 preseason and 18 regular, as opposed to the current 4 preseason and 18 regular. So this repeated argument at least one of you here has about adding two games doesn't really fly[/quote]

Smoot, no way! this is my biggest pet peeve w/the argument for 18 games. We all know that starters & often used reserves don't play many downs in the preseason to begin with. The argument that 2 preseason games = 2 regular season games in terms of chance for injury is just bunk. It surely isn't an apples to apples comparison.

Coaches will play guys in the preseason as much as they need to, thus some play very little. If anything, taking 2 preseason games away will just lead to more scrimmages, unless the cba prohibits that. 4 preseason games is more for the coaches & guys trying to make the team. The avg., established player, i.e. the vets, [I]maybe[/I] plays 4 full quarters during the entire 4 game preseason.

Not to mention, the chance of injury is greater when playing an entire game as fatigue, soreness, etc. factors in. The vast majority of guys playing most downs in the regular season are virtually never playing a full preseason game.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

The game does need more safety built in. Players used to get concussions and go right back in. Not sure how that should be viewed as ok, especially with what we know now about the long term impact of head trauma. Team doctors used to hand out pain killers like candy, probably still do to an extent. You can't tell me that's a smart way of handling things either, and who knows how many addictions started that way.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[quote=SmootSmack;842179]Not to derail this thread, but even with an 18 game season the plan is for the number of games to remain the same. 2 preseason and 18 regular, as opposed to the current 4 preseason and 18 regular. So this repeated argument at least one of you here has about adding two games doesn't really fly[/quote]

In 4 pre season games the starters really only play in two of them. The 3rd game and the 2nd. With an 18 game season the starters are going to put more strain on their bodies, and that's why none of them were buying the 18 game season.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[quote=mredskins;842193]Then maybe you should look at it as minutes played in a season or potential minutes played because you really don't know when they will be subbed and how long offense/defense will be on the field.

[B]Current minutes played by a starter baring injury and if they played every down. [/B]

16 x 60 = 960 regular season potential minutes
4 x 30 = 120 pre season potential minutes (this is assuming they play just half the game in pre-season, it is probable less then that)

Current total potential minutes played 1080

[B]18 game season [/B]

18x 60 = 1080 regular season potential minutes
2 x 30 = 60 pre-season potential minutes (they actual may play more then a half in this format since they only have 2 games to beef up)

18 game schedule total potential minutes played by a starter 1140

That gives you a delta of 60 potential more minutes (a whole game) a starter would be playing (potential for injury) in the 18 game season.


If you are full time player in the NFL you will definitely see more playing time in the 18 game format then you would in the 16 game format.[/quote]

Very well put!

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[quote=freddyg12;842195]smoot, no way! This is my biggest pet peeve w/the argument for 18 games. We all know that starters & often used reserves don't play many downs in the preseason to begin with. The argument that 2 preseason games = 2 regular season games in terms of chance for injury is just bunk. It surely isn't an apples to apples comparison.

Coaches will play guys in the preseason as much as they need to, thus some play very little. If anything, taking 2 preseason games away will just lead to more scrimmages, unless the cba prohibits that. 4 preseason games is more for the coaches & guys trying to make the team. The avg., established player, i.e. The vets, [i]maybe[/i] plays 4 full quarters during the entire 4 game preseason.

Not to mention, the chance of injury is greater when playing an entire game as fatigue, soreness, etc. Factors in. The vast majority of guys playing most downs in the regular season are virtually never playing a full preseason game.[/quote]

x2.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

skinsfan69, I can't disagree with you more. There is a reason we don't have "gladiator" events and sports. They are brutal and take a toll on players' health. The reason the regulations were not in place, was because people and the league were not aware of adverse health impacts.

If research shows playing football in a particular way could impact the health of players, change the game. I love the violent aspect of the game, but my love for the game isn't greater than my concern for the adverse impact on my fellow people. Honestly, I would go so far as saying it is selfish to value a game so much that you(the collective you, not skinsfan69) would ignore or minimize the health impacts on the players.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

As I said, I don't want to derail this thread into talk about an 18 game season. I mean WP was in the league when they expanded from 14 games to 16 games, but I don't think that caused his problems.

What I think I'll remember as much as anything is that he ended his career against the Redskins. I think it was a 4th down run and he didn't get the first and then next thing you know that's it. His career is done

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;842110]TMI, I don't want to know any of this stuff. I just want to remember the great player.[/quote]


Agreed.

We can't even be sure that this stuff is true...it wouldn't be the first time ESPN or SI was wrong on something. Their reporting is often more like a tabloid than relevant news. For example this week...did you know Tom Brady got a haircut? REALLY?

[URL="http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/new-england-patriots/post/_/id/4704492/clean-cut-brady-focused-on-raiders"]Clean-cut Brady focused on Raiders - New England Patriots Blog - ESPN Boston[/URL]
^Not so bad, you say?


[URL="http://espn.go.com/espn/page2/index?id=5820769"]What would Peyton Manning look like with Tom Brady's hair? - Page 2 - ESPN[/URL]
[URL="http://espn.go.com/blog/sportscenter/post/_/id/77222/thats-just-mannys-hair-being-mannys-hair"]That's Just Manny's Hair Being Manny's Hair - SportsCenter.com[/URL]




Even if these are facts, why does the media feel the need to bash the dead and bring up a ton of pain for the family? Let him rest in peace.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[quote=Monkeydad;842214]Agreed.

We can't even be sure that this stuff is true...it wouldn't be the first time ESPN or SI was wrong on something. Their reporting is often more like a tabloid than relevant news. For example this week...did you know Tom Brady got a haircut? REALLY?

[URL="http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/new-england-patriots/post/_/id/4704492/clean-cut-brady-focused-on-raiders"]Clean-cut Brady focused on Raiders - New England Patriots Blog - ESPN Boston[/URL]
^Not so bad, you say?


[URL="http://espn.go.com/espn/page2/index?id=5820769"]What would Peyton Manning look like with Tom Brady's hair? - Page 2 - ESPN[/URL]
[URL="http://espn.go.com/blog/sportscenter/post/_/id/77222/thats-just-mannys-hair-being-mannys-hair"]That's Just Manny's Hair Being Manny's Hair - SportsCenter.com[/URL]




Even if these are facts, why does the media feel the need to bash the dead and bring up a ton of pain for the family? Let him rest in peace.[/quote]

You do understand what Page 2 is right?

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

I heard about his hair on ESPN Radio too. They're obsessed with him like a 10YO girl at a Bieber show.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

ESPN or SI didn't write this book though.

It's perfectly relevant to report on it.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

yeah its relevant. im sure it will be in my face non stop for the next week by the media. Over-report, over analyzed, and certainly taken wayyyyyyyyyyyyy outta context and exagerated.


Mean while the author can just sit back and count $$$$$.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[quote=SmootSmack;842208][B]As I said, I don't want to derail this thread into talk about an 18 game season.[/B] I mean WP was in the league when they expanded from 14 games to 16 games, but I don't think that caused his problems.

What I think I'll remember as much as anything is that he ended his career against the Redskins. I think it was a 4th down run and he didn't get the first and then next thing you know that's it. His career is done[/quote]


Then why did you bring it up?

IMO I don't care if it is a 16 or 18 game season, they are adults they can choice not to play football.

But to say 18 game regular season sans to pre-season games is the same as a 16 game season is false advertisement.

Also IMO this topic is very relative to WP as obviously the abuse his body took in football had a profound effect on his life.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

I retract bringing it up then. I know it's not the same, I was merely attempting to point out because I believe (maybe falsely) that others think Goodell is talking about adding 2 games to the already 20 game (including preseason) schedule. That is all

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSvCmzIJEfQ]HD Walter Payton: Sweetness - YouTube[/url]

Im glad i got to see him play

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[quote=SmootSmack;842208]As I said, I don't want to derail this thread into talk about an 18 game season. I mean WP was in the league when they expanded from 14 games to 16 games, but I don't think that caused his problems.

[B]What I think I'll remember as much as anything is that he ended his career against the Redskins. I think it was a 4th down run and he didn't get the first and then next thing you know that's it. His career is done[/quote][/B]

If memory serves me correctly, it was the 87 playoff game v. the bears in soldier field, which we won on D. Green's 52 yrd. punt return. I remember that last play too, I think it was a pass to W. Payton on 4th down (4th & 7 maybe?), I can't remember if he caught it or not but I do remember him walking off the field.

Mike Golic talked about that feeling this morning, that's is so sudden but you realize it's all over.

Re: Walter Payton Used Drugs/Suicidal
 

[quote=SmootSmack;842231]I retract bringing it up then. I know it's not the same, I was merely attempting to point out because I believe (maybe falsely) that others think Goodell is talking about adding 2 games to the already 20 game (including preseason) schedule. That is all[/quote]


Ok then I see where you are coming from then.