What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

I think it is important to always look to the future of our team. What do you guys think is our biggest weakness that we must address to be raised to the next level? Of course there is room for improvement at most positions, but it is unrealistic to be able to address all our areas of weakness in a reasonable amount of time. I think we are 2 positions away from becoming real contenders; I feel like we are weakest on the OL and DL (more DL).
I'll be the first to admit that I said in the offseason that our WR's were atrocious and unable to produce, I also said that the McNabb trade was not worth the second and third picks, but I have had a change of heart. I still think we are among the worst receiving cores in the league, but I do not think it matters as much as I used to because McNabb has been absolutely incredible. He makes our passing game at least respectable despite having almost nothing to work with.
So back to where we need to improve to be raised into legitimate contenders. The DL and OL. From what I can see the DL is getting zero push. Teams are able to pass all over us because the quarterbacks are not getting the pocket collapsed on them in time. Our blitzes are also not as effective because of the weak push in the trenches. I watch the push that other teams get on us and it upsets me that we seem to never collapse the pocket like others seem to do to us. Fortunately we have McNabb who has be phenomenal at avoiding the pressure, but I can't help but think that we'd put up another td every game if we had a stronger OL push to help us with the run game (I do not think we get adequate push there either...Indy was an exception because they are so small) and give McNabb more time. I also feel that we have gotten extremely lucky on defense so far. It seems that offenses are able to drive on us every game, but somehow something always happens where their points don't reflect how they are dominating us. I feel that if we had a stronger DL everything would change. Our LB's DB's WR's RB's TE's QB's and FB's might not all be perfect, but I feel as if they are good enough that if we improve in the trenches we should be a legitimate playoff team, no questions asked.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

The easy answer is:

1) 1 or 2 more years of adding the right personnel
2) 1 or 2 more years of the players playing in the same scheme

pretty much what we knew before the regular season began.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

[quote=skinster;749570]I think it is important to always look to the future of our team. What do you guys think is our biggest weakness that we must address to be raised to the next level? Of course there is room for improvement at most positions, but it is unrealistic to be able to address all our areas of weakness in a reasonable amount of time. I think we are 2 positions away from becoming real contenders; I feel like we are weakest on the OL and DL (more DL).
I'll be the first to admit that I said in the offseason that our WR's were atrocious and unable to produce, I also said that the McNabb trade was not worth the second and third picks, but I have had a change of heart. I still think we are among the worst receiving cores in the league, but I do not think it matters as much as I used to because McNabb has been absolutely incredible. He makes our passing game at least respectable despite having almost nothing to work with.
So back to where we need to improve to be raised into legitimate contenders. The DL and OL. From what I can see the DL is getting zero push. Teams are able to pass all over us because the quarterbacks are not getting the pocket collapsed on them in time. Our blitzes are also not as effective because of the weak push in the trenches. I watch the push that other teams get on us and it upsets me that we seem to never collapse the pocket like others seem to do to us. Fortunately we have McNabb who has be phenomenal at avoiding the pressure, but I can't help but think that we'd put up another td every game if we had a stronger OL push to help us with the run game (I do not think we get adequate push there either...Indy was an exception because they are so small) and give McNabb more time. I also feel that we have gotten extremely lucky on defense so far. It seems that offenses are able to drive on us every game, but somehow something always happens where their points don't reflect how they are dominating us. I feel that if we had a stronger DL everything would change. Our LB's DB's WR's RB's TE's QB's and FB's might not all be perfect, but I feel as if they are good enough that if we improve in the trenches we should be a legitimate playoff team, no questions asked.[/quote]

Sorry forgot to add what I wanted to say about how much improvement is needed. I think that we need two quality interior linemen (doesnt matter which positions), and one impact DL and one quality DL (doesn't matter what positions).
I think our OL doesn't need to dominate anything, they just need to be good enough so that Mcnabb can do his thing and so that we have a little more confidence in our run game. I am not worried so much about Brown or Williams for next year, they will both improve, just the interior who I do not see getting anything but worse.
I think that we need one DL which will wreak havoc and push the pocket/draw the double team, and one DL which can benefit from the other wreaking havoc. The second DL needs to just be good enough that he can get a reasonable amount of push, and I do not see anyone on our roster that is adequate to fill either of these roles in my mind (this is all said assuming Haynsworth is gone next year).

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

I think we need to keep working on the O-line.

We are set at quarterback for the next season or 2.

We have a bona fide starter and feature back in Ryan Torain, who is still very young.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

With the parity in the NFL these day anything could happen.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

Torain is going to have to play well for the entire season (and perhaps then some) before I check feature runningback off my list of player needs. Not saying he cant be a good player or hasnt shown some promise thus far but I dont want to crown the kid just yet just like Horton was overly praised a few years ago.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

More than anything, we need more time with the new systems. More playmakers on both sides is a given.

As far as Torain goes, I'm a fan but I'm not convinced he's the long term answer as the starter either. He's a grinder, but not a home run threat. It would be nice to find someone that can really scare a D with big play ability.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

2-3 years of solid drafts. Quantity and quality. And of course time in this system.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

I think we missed a great opportunity to bring Lynch here. Coulda been a great fit. That said, this team is either beating or hanging with tough opponents week in and week out, we're not that far off.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

[quote=12thMan;749600]I think we missed a great opportunity to bring Lynch here. Coulda been a great fit. That said, this team is either beating or hanging with tough opponents week in and week out, we're not that far off.[/quote]I don't know. Haven't we traded enough draft picks for others trash over the years? Lynch isn't any good.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

Last night, the Skins made mistakes and blew big opportunities throughout the game. And we were all like damn, not again.

But when the Colts threw interceptions, dropped the football, missed field goals the thinking was "that's not like the Colts at all"

For us to get to the next level, we have to make mistakes the exception not the norm.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

[quote=GTripp0012;749601]I don't know. Haven't we traded enough draft picks for others trash over the years? Lynch isn't any good.[/quote]

Agreed. Lynch would have made a lot of sense for the Pack, but I don't think we needed to give up picks for him. Better guys can be had next year in the draft for a lot less.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

We pretty clearly don't yet have all the personnel to play the system the coach's want. That means good drafting and FA pickups are a must. Even without the right personnel, we're not as bad as last year, not by a long shot.

And for all that, we're clearly leaving points, TOs, etc. on the field each game. So that points to execution, which points to practice and comfort in a system, as everyone's been pointing out.

We were a 4-12 team, the oldest in league, with few draft picks. It's gonna take time folks. Thanks, Vinny!

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

[quote=GTripp0012;749601]I don't know. Haven't we traded enough draft picks for others trash over the years? Lynch isn't any good.[/quote]

Forsett outgained him despite getting a smaller workload. Just pointing that out.

Lynch = 17 for 44, TD

Forsett = 10 for 67, TD



[IMG]http://www.kornheiserscartel.com/uploaded_images/MarshawnLynch-774851.jpg[/IMG]

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

[quote=over the mountain;749590]Torain is going to have to play well for the entire season (and perhaps then some) before I check feature runningback off my list of player needs. Not saying he cant be a good player or hasnt shown some promise thus far but I dont want to crown the kid just yet just like Horton was overly praised a few years ago.[/quote]

I agree with your assessment on Terain. He's shown flashes and he also has his limitations. (1) demonstrate he can stay reasonably healthy for a season, (2) duplicate his best efforts on a consistent basis so he dosen't slip into that "hero" with accolades one week to he "sucks" the next.

The team needs a lot before it reaches the point where it's considered a legitimate contender on a consistent basis. Our areas of need are well documented, but just how we'll go about acquiring the personell necessary to fulfill those needs remains a mystery. The draft is not exactly a cure all unless we're talking about multiple ones.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

Talent

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

[QUOTE]quoted by Skinster
[B]What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level[/B]?[/QUOTE]

We need a bonafide true #1 WR period.
When you don't have that true #1 WR,you allow the defense to play any type of scheme they desire.

A great #1,forces defense to roll their coverage to his side and a Safety over the top. This gives the other players on offense a better chance at making plays.

If they don't have a Safety over the top,you can score on a big play easily. (ie R.Moss,TO,A.Johnson,etc)

Just having Armstrong go deep and making plays has helped us win 2 games...(Eagles & packers alone) And he's really probably a true #3 WR,but playing as our #2.

All teams need to do is shut down Moss and Cooley and they have a good chance at beating us. (Moss still had 8 catches,but didn't hurt them deep...Armstrong didn't hurt them deep and neither did Galloway)

This is why I believe you need a player of V.Jackson's skill or some other player who can get the respect of a true #1 WR. Just him being on the field alone,would allow bigger plays from the other players,such as cooley,moss or armstrong. Not to mention it also helps the running game because the defense is so focused on stopping your #1 WR and you gash them with your running.

Moss is very good,but he's getting old and has probably always been a great #2 wr.
Armstrong is playing great,but will always be that #2 or #3 as well.

We don't have a #1 and we need one,if we're going to be a SB contender.
I'm sorry,but this is just how it is.

If we are not going to go out and get a true #1 wr......then we better go find Brian Westbrook and clone him cause McNabb is going to need someone with that skill set,to offset not having a true #1...Just like when mcnabb was in philly.

Unfortunately,VJ is the only WR that's a true #1 that is available now in a trade.
So we will have to wait till next season. (if there is one)

Until then,you can expect the same dogfight games that go down to the very last play.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

[quote=Buster;749625]Forsett outgained him despite getting a smaller workload. Just pointing that out.

Lynch = 17 for 44, TD

Forsett = 10 for 67, TD



[IMG]http://www.kornheiserscartel.com/uploaded_images/MarshawnLynch-774851.jpg[/IMG][/quote]

Ehh, it's typically easier for running backs to pick up a system, but it's not one week easy.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

Don't have time to give a comprehensive list right now, so I'll just point out one thing.
Better fat boys. Both Oline and D line

The same Packers D line that was KILLING us last week was at least being handled decently by the Miami O-line. McNabb is probably hurting big after every game thanks to our o-line still being a sieve at times.

Giving up whatever giant amount of yards to the COLTS is not excusable. Most of our dlinemen are average at best. We need a true NT like Hampton, Ngata. Those guys. Golston IS NOT A 3-4 DE. Hell, he wasn't that great of a 4-3 DT in the first place.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

After watching last nights game I agree that we need a true #1 to compete with the best of the NFL. V jackson would be nice but probably unrealistic as AJ smith (AKA the lord of no rings!) is vindictive to a fault and wont want to trade him, although Haynesworth and a #4 sound good to anyone??? At this point I think we need to look to next season to get a #1, the list of available free agents is Randy Moss (no thanks!) Sidney Rice (intriguing) Santonio Holmes (low character guy) and Braylon Edwards...everyone else is a #2....

So if we are to draft a WR the best in my opinion is AJ Green out of Georgia but we will hopefully not have a high enough pick to take him!

So then we are looking at either Baldwin from Purdue or Julio Jones from Alabama, I'd rather take Jones.

Either way that's what I see as our biggest need, and sorry to be bringing up draft already!

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;749646]Ehh, it's typically easier for running backs to pick up a system, but it's not one week easy.[/quote]

At the end of the year I still see Forsett being a better RB.

Lynch COULD have been great, but he's an underachiever. He's not a #1 RB anymore.

Forsett is young and versatile...has a bright future ahead of him.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

Its a common mispreception but Haloti is primarily if not exclusively their RE.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

[quote=over the mountain;749656]Its a common mispreception but Haloti is primarily if not exclusively their RE.[/quote]

Golston still needs to be replaced, so my point still stands. Good 3-4s dominate YARDS, POINTS AND TURNOVERS.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

[quote=SirClintonPortis;749653]Don't have time to give a comprehensive list right now, so I'll just point out one thing.
Better fat boys. Both Oline and D line

The same Packers D line that was KILLING us last week was at least being handled decently by the Miami O-line. McNabb is probably hurting big after every game thanks to our o-line still being a sieve at times.

[B]Giving up whatever giant amount of yards to the COLTS is not excusable. Most of our dlinemen are average at best. We need a true NT like Hampton, Ngata. Those guys. Golston IS NOT A 3-4 DE. Hell, he wasn't that great of a 4-3 DT in the first place.[/B][/quote]

I agree. Carriker is serviceable. But we lack a decent NT and another decent DE. Golston is depth at best.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

#1 - keep our draft picks and have a solid 7 rounds of picks (not happening next year)
#2 - Get some help on the D-Line. If you arent going to use Big Al, which all though may have been gassed last night, would have helped with pressure up the middle, and stopping the endless runs between the tackles last night also.
#3 - Oline needs a true guard. I think with the o-line we have, it can be successful if they stay together. We can't keep plugging guys in every year and expect them to be good. They have to play together for a few years before we see some cohesion.
#4 - Everyone is crying for a #1 WR. It would be nice, but I would gladly take what we have now and keep that there next year. I think we need to see more cooley / davis formations. Armstrong may turn out to be a decent to good WR, maybe we can get a late pick that will contribute.
#5 - a freaking kicker that is reliable. How can we not find a guy that can make field goals. Anymore, seems like 45 to 48 are all most automatic for good kickers and this dude scares me from 35!

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

Stickum?

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

[quote=#56fanatic;749677]#1 - keep our draft picks and have a solid 7 rounds of picks (not happening next year)
#2 - Get some help on the D-Line. If you arent going to use Big Al, which all though may have been gassed last night, would have helped with pressure up the middle, and stopping the endless runs between the tackles last night also.
#3 - Oline needs a true guard. I think with the o-line we have, it can be successful if they stay together. We can't keep plugging guys in every year and expect them to be good. They have to play together for a few years before we see some cohesion.
#4 - Everyone is crying for a #1 WR. It would be nice, but I would gladly take what we have now and keep that there next year. I think we need to see more cooley / davis formations. Armstrong may turn out to be a decent to good WR, maybe we can get a late pick that will contribute.
#5 - a freaking kicker that is reliable. How can we not find a guy that can make field goals. Anymore, seems like 45 to 48 are all most automatic for good kickers and this dude scares me from 35![/quote]

#1 I agree that it would be nice to have 7 picks for once, but Ill take brown this year over any tackle we could have drafted with that pick
#2 Couldnt agree more but I would also say we didnt have Rocky last night so some of those runs wouldnt have been so bad
#3 Agreed no one could argue that point
#4 #1 WRs free up everything else, last night it looked like they were playing 8 and 9 in the box most of the night
#5 I fondly remember the days of Chip Lohmiller. It was nice to have some confidence in a kicker!

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

If we can get a #1 WR now,we should pull the trigger if the cost is @ a 2nd round pick or lower..
(or multiple lower round picks like a 4th and a 5th or whatever using 2011 and 2012 draft years))

Or we could keep our draft pick and draft Malcolm Kelly or Devin Thomas? Yea..lets do that! Lets build through the draft...
Booooom botta......Biiiiiiing!
ace is in the house....lol

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

[quote=aceinthehouse;749690]If we can get a #1 WR now,we should pull the trigger if the cost is @ a 2nd round pick or lower..
(or multiple lower round picks like a 4th and a 5th or whatever using 2011 and 2012 draft years))

Or we could keep our draft pick and draft Malcolm Kelly or Devin Thomas? Yea..lets do that! Lets build through the draft...
Booooom botta......Biiiiiiing!
ace is in the house....lol[/quote]

While the elite "big" #1 is [B]A[/B] formula for success, some teams have won Super Bowls without a elite "big" WR at all.

See Pats(ok, maybe cheating was involved, but they still cut it close), Colts(ok, Polian rule-mongered it a bit), Steelers(refs make that questionable), Saints(Breesus is better than McNabb)

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

I'm sick of hearing how great Chip Lohmiller was.

The guy missed multiple kicks from under 40yds every season. :soapbox:

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

Nothing has changed from what most of us thought before preseason began. We still need a revamped offensive line and a real WR corp. Not sure we can draft a quality WR this season although there are plenty to go around. I mentioned Sanzenbacher and Stonum as possibles, but I forgot we gave up a second and third pick for Donovan, Those two are either first or second rounders, but we really need a starting G.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

We need to shore up our offensive line even more. Beef up our WR corps and RB corps at this point. We need to strike a good balance between who we bring in via free agency and the draft.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

[quote=TheSmurfs22;749836]We need to shore up our offensive line even more. Beef up our WR corps and RB corps at this point. We need to strike a good balance between who we bring in via free agency and the draft.[/quote]

I agree. I would like to see us nab younger FAs though. This Galloway type of stuff has to go. I remember how we landed Centers when he was becoming a hot item and he helped us out immensly.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

I think its a little early to be evaluating what we need just yet. Guys are still getting familiar with the systems.

But Ill state the obvious: A starting Nose Tackle, O-line X 2, speed addtion at RB, and a WR that can move Galloway from the starting line up.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

"A Good" 2nd RB to alternate with Torain.

A WR like TO would have run down some of those deep passes. (speed and hight)

Most here won't agree but we need to develop a younger starting QB to develop with this team. If we make it into the playoffs you will see what I mean. I know, I know, McNabb...

We are setting ourselves up to be a future powerhouse team without a QB. At this point.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

[quote=aceinthehouse;749690]If we can get a #1 WR now,we should pull the trigger if the cost is @ a 2nd round pick or lower..
(or multiple lower round picks like a 4th and a 5th or whatever using 2011 and 2012 draft years))

Or we could keep our draft pick and draft Malcolm Kelly or Devin Thomas? Yea..lets do that! Lets build through the draft...
Booooom botta......Biiiiiiing!
ace is in the house....lol[/quote]

Absolutely not. This is what gets us in trouble every year come draft time. Just deal with the talent we have for now and build through the draft. Can't keep giving the damn picks away. We need those later round picks as much as we do the first 3 rounds. The 4-7th (if a good GM) is what rounds out the team. I would rather keep what we have and build through the draft. We all have discussed this 1000 times. not worth going over and over

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

nobody's stating the obvious...our seconday absolutly stinks. Other than Landry, the rest of these guys need to go to the UFL!! Carlos Rodgers can't catch a cold, Reed Doughty...can't even comment, and Deangelo Hall is all talk. These guys don't scare anybody

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

Carlos is an excellent cover corner. D-Hall is a playmaker and good cover guy as well. Buchanon is a solid nickel/backup CB.

Our safeties are not bad. Landry is a star of course, Kareem Moore is a solid young player with some progress yet to be made (dropping INTs), but is improving. Doughty is a solid tackler, but bad cover guy and Horton...not sure. Horton looked to be a great player in his rookie year but has been unseen since.

Overall, our secondary is pretty good I'd say. If a few guys could learn to catch the ball, we'd be intimidating. Seems like our cover guys can cover but not tackle and our playmakers can get their hands on the ball but can't tackle.

Landry can do everything though.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

[quote=SmootSmack;749607]Last night, the Skins made mistakes and blew big opportunities throughout the game. And we were all like damn, not again.

But when the Colts threw interceptions, dropped the football, missed field goals the thinking was "that's not like the Colts at all"

For us to get to the next level, we have to make mistakes the exception not the norm.[/quote]

I already see us doing this.

Re: What is necessary for us to be raised to the next level?
 

[quote=Buster;750086]Carlos is an excellent cover corner. D-Hall is a playmaker and good cover guy as well. Buchanon is a solid nickel/backup CB.

Our safeties are not bad. Landry is a star of course, [B]Kareem Moore is a solid young player with some progress yet to be made (dropping INTs)[/B], but is improving. Doughty is a solid tackler, but bad cover guy and Horton...not sure. Horton looked to be a great player in his rookie year but has been unseen since.

Overall, our secondary is pretty good I'd say. If a few guys could learn to catch the ball, we'd be intimidating. Seems like our cover guys can cover but not tackle and our playmakers can get their hands on the ball but can't tackle.

Landry can do everything though.[/quote]

Kareem also needs to work on his tackling if he is to be our last line of defense.