Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

Did anyone listen to Clinton Portis on the John Thompson show earlier today? He didn't come right out and explicitly blast Zorn, but it was pretty obvious that Portis and Zorn have some serious issues to work out. Portis took issue with being benched, seemed to take a shot at Zorn when he said in sarcastic tone that "the head coach is a genius," and said that everyone needs to look at themselves to see what they are doing wrong (and, in the context of the interview, he seemed to imply that the coaches need to look at what they are doing wrong). Sorry, I wasn't taking notes and so I can't give you a blow-by-blow account of the interview. In any case, based on Portis' tone, it sounds like Zorn may be losing control of the locker room.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

Zorn has been making some dumb decisions and play calls also. He doens't use the personnel we have wisely too. Why did they log a go route to ARE during the game..Wouldn't that been a better play for Kelly or Devin..Why aren't we using Davis. Why was Portis benched? Why don't we atleast try to go down the field more..Questions..Zorn called plays good when he mixed in the run..But then I think he got obssessed with passing the ball to set up the run instead of vice versa..I am very disappointed..

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

I posed the question after this past Sunday. There was no confidence offensively. Guys seemed like they'd rather be elsewhere. CP standing there in the fourth quarter. Bad playcalling. Little to no adjustments whatsoever.

All of this adds up to lack of faith and/or lack of leadership. Just a guess but maybe not too far off base.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

things dont sound good and one caller just asked if maybe vc and danny boy were hoping to get cower after the season and maybe zorn was just to get by for a year and put zorn back at oc

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

Hmmm. Clinton please don't start.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[quote=dmvskinzfan08;509936]Zorn has been making some dumb decisions and play calls also. He doens't use the personnel we have wisely too. Why did they log a go route to ARE during the game..Wouldn't that been a better play for Kelly or Devin..Why aren't we using Davis. Why was Portis benched? Why don't we atleast try to go down the field more..Questions..Zorn called plays good when he mixed in the run..But then I think he got obssessed with passing the ball to set up the run instead of vice versa..I am very disappointed..[/quote]

Well remember the on our first drive JC went back for a long pass and someone hit his arm causing the ball to fly up in the air and get int. Thats why we don't go down field.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[url=http://voices.washingtonpost.com/redskinsinsider/2008/12/portis_rips_zorn.html]Portis Rips Zorn - Redskins Insider[/url]

Uh oh, hear it comes.

RI: Portis Rips Zorn

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[quote=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;509934]Did anyone listen to Clinton Portis on the John Thompson show earlier today? He didn't come right out and explicitly blast Zorn, but it was pretty obvious that Portis and Zorn have some serious issues to work out. Portis took issue with being benched, seemed to take a shot at Zorn when he said in sarcastic tone that "the head coach is a genius," and said that everyone needs to look at themselves to see what they are doing wrong (and, in the context of the interview, he seemed to imply that the coaches need to look at what they are doing wrong). Sorry, I wasn't taking notes and so I can't give you a blow-by-blow account of the interview. In any case, based on Portis' tone, it sounds like Zorn may be losing control of the locker room.[/quote]

Yeah, I can tell you for a fact that the locker room is a bit of a mess right now. But look, this is the first real adversity Zorn has ever had to deal with as an NFL head coach. It would have been ridiculous to think he would never have to face this-a bad losing streak while massaging massive egos-but if we want to be truly committed to him and to buidling success for the long term than he needs to prove he can get through it.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

I gotta agree w/ Portis and that's why I started the thread about him being on the sideline.

There are plenty of players that don't practice when they are as banged up as he is. He's in the meetings. He knows whats going on.

Now, maybe he doesn't need to air it out the way he's doing but he is an honest guy. So, if he was asked the question, he answered it.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[quote=SmootSmack;509960][B]Yeah, I can tell you for a fact that the locker room is a bit of a mess right now. [/B]But look, this is the first real adversity Zorn has ever had to deal with as an NFL head coach. It would have been ridiculous to think he would never have to face this-a bad losing streak while massaging massive egos-but if we want to be truly committed to him and to buidling success for the long term than he needs to prove he can get through it.[/quote]

Can you go into this a little more?

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[quote=47FAN;509941]things dont sound good and one caller just asked if maybe vc and danny boy were hoping to get cower after the season and maybe zorn was just to get by for a year and put zorn back at oc[/quote]

First off the only way Zorn would go back to OC is if this was arranged last year when he became head coach. Secong I heard some on interviewed (forgot who they were) and they said Cowher is happy retired and has ruled out any chances of him coming back in 2009. The person said there was just a slight chance he would give it any thought in 2010. He said Cowher does not care about the money and is happy having alot of more time to spend with his family. He also pointed out Cowher is still young and can afford to wait until he is ready to coach again.

Even if that did go down the O has been Zorns problem so why would he stay on as O coach?

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[quote=skinsfan69;509966]Can you go into this a little more?[/quote]

Just people I've talked to have said that Zorn is treating veterans and rookies equally and that just doesn't work in the NFL. Veterans expect a different level of respect. Further, almost all the players don't like that he's been calling out the players on execution and seemingly taking no blame for the schemes. Additionally, some players say that Campbell has been blaming others in the locker room for his struggles. It's a bit of a mess right now mainly stemming from losing and the frustrations that go along with that.

Having a tight, cohesive locker room is one of (some would say the only one) Gibbs' traits that is sorely missed right now. But I think it's a passing thing that will improve.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

I pray that we have a Sgt. at Arms, someone like London Fletcher, who will tell Portis to watch his mouth and be the obedient soldier. Portis is tough, talented and a fan favorite, but sometimes he is insubordinate and is too eager to play the role of martyred malcontent. What good does it do to gripe in public or in the locker room? If players have a problem with things the coaches are doing, they should air the grievances through the appropriate channels and in the appropriate, respectful manner.

I love Portis and have defended him repeatedly, but he is out of line. He needs to understand his role and play it.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

And if players are tearing one another down in the locker room after just 4 losses, things are worse than I thought. Quitters and loser throw people under the bus, teammates do not. I wish Daniels was around to keep things in check.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[quote=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;509971]I pray that we have a Sgt. at Arms, someone like London Fletcher, who will tell Portis to watch his mouth and be the obedient soldier. Portis is tough, talented and a fan favorite, but sometimes he is insubordinate and is too eager to play the role of martyred malcontent. What good does it do to gripe in public or in the locker room? If players have a problem with things the coaches are doing, they should air the grievances through the appropriate channels and in the appropriate, respectful manner.

I love Portis and have defended him repeatedly, but he is out of line. He needs to understand his role and play it.[/quote]

He does play the everybody is out to get me, martyred malcontent alot.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

While I don't think it's a good idea to air all this crap out through the media, CP has every right to be frustrated. The dude is a workhorse and has done most everything ever asked of him on the field. If he truly is as banged up as it's been reported, then God bless him for sucking it all up and at least trying to contribute game time. Yeah, it'd be great for him to practice, but if you're that wrecked, how can you expect him to make any real contribution for what is left of our season?

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

Well when he went public about the line not giving him holes the holes appeared maybe now Zorn will call a better game.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[quote=redsk1;509955][url=http://voices.washingtonpost.com/redskinsinsider/2008/12/portis_rips_zorn.html]Portis Rips Zorn - Redskins Insider[/url]

Uh oh, hear it comes.

RI: Portis Rips Zorn[/quote]

This sucks! Sounds like Zorn has lost portis! Also sounds like Portis just freaking hates Zorn!

Sounds like, based on Portis' words, and based on Zorn's protection schemes, and based on Zorn's decision to keep only two back up lineman on the bench, and based that Zorn can't accept any blame, and based on Zorn's words of "get the ball out quicker!"........................................It sounds like Zorn doesn't know what the heck he's doing! I hope he learns quick. This season is a wash, but if Zorn doesn't fix this quickly; next year will be a wash too!

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

Growing pains, not unexpected during a tough stretch like this. Let's win against Cincy--that will help the most.

CP shouldn't do this, but it's not a surprise. He's always been given slightly different treatment; he's an odd but very talented guy.

Zorn needs to learn about how to handle these things. It will take some time. To be honest, I'm glad it's happening. He has to be able to deal with this kind of adversity and player management, or he cannot be a head coach in the NFL.

No way Danny and Vinny should touch Zorn--one, give the guy a friggin chance! Two, who would EVER want to coach here with management like that? Three, first year had coach, new passing system, new line adjustment system, first year for JC in the system, weak and injured o-line, rookie WRs who can't make an impact. Give it some time!

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[quote=Dlyne8r;509976]While I don't think it's a good idea to air all this crap out through the media, CP has every right to be frustrated. The dude is a workhorse and has done most everything ever asked of him on the field. If he truly is as banged up as it's been reported, then God bless him for sucking it all up and at least trying to contribute game time. Yeah, it'd be great for him to practice, but if you're that wrecked, how can you expect him to make any real contribution for what is left of our season?[/quote]

Did you watch the Zorn presser? He wasn't ripping Portis. He didn't say he was benched because he didn't practice. He said Betts was doing better in the passing game (basically), that they were behind and had to pass, that they were trying to get Portis healthy, etc. I know what Portis is referring to, the part where Zorn said that Portis was helping too much in pass pro and not getting into routes, but it takes a pretty thin skin to take that to the level that Portis did. He is a great player, but super high maintanence as well. Gibbs understood that (or accomodated that) and coddled Portis. Zorn is not. Now Portis is pouting. But it's BS. Zorn might be well advised to follow a more Gibbsian model in his pressers (the reporters hated it, but being tight lipped helps hold a locker room together) but that is not his style and I doubt he will pull back. But go watch the presser and see if you think Zorn's comments warranted a very Owens-like outburst by Clinton Portis.

Having said all that, much of the offensive struggles have to fall to Zorn. If your offense, that you implemented and call plays in, has scored fewer points than Detroit then execution is probably not the only problem. But Portis' comments are still way out of line.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[quote=SmootSmack;509960][B]Yeah, I can tell you for a fact that the locker room is a bit of a mess right now.[/B] But look, this is the first real adversity Zorn has ever had to deal with as an NFL head coach. It would have been ridiculous to think he would never have to face this-a bad losing streak while massaging massive egos-but if we want to be truly committed to him and to buidling success for the long term than he needs to prove he can get through it.[/quote]

This would've never happened if Gibbs was still around. Boy, I start missing Gibbs v.2.0 more and more every Sunday.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

I disagree that it's a bad thing that Portis is airing things out. How many times have we seen the Giants air out their dirty laundry and go kick some ass? I mean, everybody - everybody in NY has been thrown under the bus. This is part of the NFL culture in 2000's. You play through adversity and public criticism. Bottom line, different teams respond to different things.

Dallas has played through it. The Eagles have constantly played through it. Why can't the Redskins take a little public heat from one of their superstars and get shit together? Besides, who balls and plays hurt more than Portis. No one.

It's not like he said Zorn is horrible and needs to be replaced. Now that's out of line. He just called a spade without calling it spade.

And I mean no disrespect here, but if Gibbs no drama rule worked so good, we would have won more.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[quote=SC Skins Fan;509985]Did you watch the Zorn presser? He wasn't ripping Portis. He didn't say he was benched because he didn't practice. He said Betts was doing better in the passing game (basically), that they were behind and had to pass, that they were trying to get Portis healthy, etc. I know what Portis is referring to, the part where Zorn said that Portis was helping too much in pass pro and not getting into routes, [B]but it takes a pretty thin skin to take that to the level that Portis did. He is a great player, but super high maintanence as well. Gibbs understood that (or accomodated that) and coddled Portis. Zorn is not. Now Portis is pouting.[/B] But it's BS. Zorn might be well advised to follow a more Gibbsian model in his pressers (the reporters hated it, but being tight lipped helps hold a locker room together) but that is not his style and I doubt he will pull back. But go watch the presser and see if you think Zorn's comments warranted a very Owens-like outburst by Clinton Portis.

Having said all that, much of the offensive struggles have to fall to Zorn. If your offense, that you implemented and call plays in, has scored fewer points than Detroit then execution is probably not the only problem. But Portis' comments are still way out of line.[/quote]


i could not have said it better myself.
nice post

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

Based on what I've seen on tape, Zorn did the only thing he could do to help this team win. Did it work? No. But he's not wrong for doing that.

This is Portis' problem. He's still the focal point of the offense, and he has a historically short memory so I think he'll be fine. But he agreed to sign here for a bunch of years guarenteed, so it's his job, not Zorn's to make him be a team player. We know how hard the guy is willing to work when he's committed to a cause, but we can't afford to have a lack of production from Portis if he isn't going to work at it.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[quote=dmvskinzfan08;509936]Zorn has been making some dumb decisions and play calls also. He doens't use the personnel we have wisely too. Why did they log a go route to ARE during the game..Wouldn't that been a better play for Kelly or Devin..Why aren't we using Davis. Why was Portis benched? Why don't we atleast try to go down the field more..Questions..Zorn called plays good when he mixed in the run..But then I think he got obssessed with passing the ball to set up the run instead of vice versa..I am very disappointed..[/quote]

i dont agree with much from your post, sorry. i was on WP this morning and everything was normal, come back tonight and were bashin zorn. that damn examiner . .

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[quote=SmootSmack;509970]. Further, almost all the players don't like that he's been calling out the players on execution and seemingly taking no blame for the schemes. [/quote]

Ive noticed that tone from the start in his press conferences. I was concerned about it at first but it kind of slipped to the back burner in my mind. I always kind of took him like he was enjoying the celebrity a bit too much but kept my mouth shut because everyone seemed not to mind... but he does call out players a lot.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

oh, and i understand that portis is def. a primadonna, but you expect it from some players... and he's not that bad and will do what he's asked on the field...

zorn has to hold the team together. we'll see how it all pans out.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

Who would have guessed when we sat at 6-2 that come the 2nd week of December we'd be discussing Zorn's job security, missing the playoffs, coaches calling out players, players calling out coaches, people suggesting Colt unseat JC as starter....

Unreal. Nothing is EVER easy as a Redskins fan.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

Kevin Locket once told me (yeah that's right I'm name dropping) that it's very easy to win as a team. But the true test is when you can lose as a team. Because it's a lot easier to just be individual players when you're losing. And I think it was London Fletcher who made that same point last year when he said (to paraphrase) "Even when we were losing, Coach Gibbs never let us lose sight of the fact that we're a team. And we win and lose together."

This is something Zorn, I'm sure, will fix sooner than later.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[quote=SC Skins Fan;509985]Did you watch the Zorn presser? He wasn't ripping Portis. He didn't say he was benched because he didn't practice. He said Betts was doing better in the passing game (basically), that they were behind and had to pass, that they were trying to get Portis healthy, etc. I know what Portis is referring to, the part where Zorn said that Portis was helping too much in pass pro and not getting into routes, but it takes a pretty thin skin to take that to the level that Portis did. He is a great player, but super high maintanence as well. Gibbs understood that (or accomodated that) and coddled Portis. Zorn is not. Now Portis is pouting. But it's BS. Zorn might be well advised to follow a more Gibbsian model in his pressers (the reporters hated it, but being tight lipped helps hold a locker room together) but that is not his style and I doubt he will pull back. But go watch the presser and see if you think Zorn's comments warranted a very Owens-like outburst by Clinton Portis.

Having said all that, much of the offensive struggles have to fall to Zorn. If your offense, that you implemented and call plays in, has scored fewer points than Detroit then execution is probably not the only problem. But Portis' comments are still way out of line.[/quote]

Unfortunately, no, I did not see the presser as I no longer subscribe to CSN here in the ATL (no thanks to our local economy), nor did I see it anywhere else. But, thanks for enlightening me on Zorn's reasoning. Look, even though I'm completely in the tank for CP, I'm painfully aware of his need to have his ego stroked and that he can be very high maintenance. However, sometimes it's impossible to keep everything pent up inside and you must vent. It's very likely that CP being so emotional is what gives him such great drive and determination. Yet, I do wish that he had not made his feelings known in the media as now it will become just another distraction.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

if jim zorn does not address this issue now, he could lose the locker room. there is already a building sentiment of jim zorn not being able to take any blame for the loses. i just think that if he doesnt address this issue swiftly and appropriately, not only could this season be lost, but his job depends on it....which in turn means so does jason cambells.......i think if we get a new coach we would have to get a new qb. either a veteran or someone already there or draft.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

Just listened to the portis' audio clip from the JT show. (easy to find at espn980.com/audiovault/).

Man, coach thompson and BM have portis talkin to them like hes on the phone talking to old friends and its not being recorded or broadcast live.

its easy to see how portis lets his guard down with these guys. first portis is calling in and not actually in the studio where he would kinda be more "professional" or vanilla if you would. second he calls and coach T has that great deep voice of "hey whats goin on with ya" kinda father relaxin like. so it may open portis up alil or put him off his guard. then they just keep askin him about his benching, not jumpin in or interrupting portis so he just keeps on talkin and talkin, when portis finally does stop talkin the next question is about the same thing . . . coach T and BM would make great attorneys, people would just forget their under oath and just start shooting the breeze with them.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[url=http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/12/09/portis-not-happy-with-zorn/]ProFootballTalk.com - PORTIS NOT HAPPY WITH ZORN[/url]

Here is a related article on profootballtalk.com

Portis needs to STFU. Zorn is the coach, he calls the shots. Period.

Stuff like this is why Portis rubs me the wrong way, 2nd time this year he has thrown teamates/coaches under the bus. He always gets a pass though.

Like previously said, this would never happen under Gibbs. Above all the Skins were family under Gibbs... even during the 5-11 season you got the sense that everyone was soldout for the team first concept.

Great point by a previous poster...."Quitters and losers start blaming others when things go wrong."

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[quote=maroonandblack30;510030][url=http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/12/09/portis-not-happy-with-zorn/]ProFootballTalk.com - PORTIS NOT HAPPY WITH ZORN[/url]

Here is a related article on profootballtalk.com

Portis needs to STFU. [B]Zorn is the coach, he calls the shots[/B]. Period.

Stuff like this is why Portis rubs me the wrong way, [B]2nd time this year he has thrown teamates/coaches under the bus[/B]. He always gets a pass though.

Like previously said, this would never happen under Gibbs. Above all the Skins were family under Gibbs... even during the 5-11 season you got the sense that everyone was soldout for the team first concept.

Great point by a previous poster...."Quitters and losers start blaming others when things go wrong."[/quote]

In response to your first comment, yes, you're absolutely correct, Zorn [I][U]is[/U][/I] the boss. But, in response to your other comment, sometimes you gotta get in someone's face when they aren't performing (i.e.-CP's comment about the O-line earlier this season). It happens in our families, at work, etc. Not long after that statement, our O-line improved and possibly because they were called out. Who really knows. Maybe CP is hoping for the same response from Zorn...doubtful, and the wrong place to do it, but maybe he just thinks out loud too much.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[quote=SmootSmack;509960]Yeah, I can tell you for a fact that the locker room is a bit of a mess right now. But look, this is the first real adversity Zorn has ever had to deal with as an NFL head coach. It would have been ridiculous to think he would never have to face this-a bad losing streak while massaging massive egos-but if we want to be truly committed to him and to buidling success for the long term than he needs to prove he can get through it.[/quote]

Perfectly said.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[quote=Dlyne8r;510038]In response to your first comment, yes, you're absolutely correct, Zorn [I][U]is[/U][/I] the boss. But, in response to your other comment, sometimes you gotta get in someone's face when they aren't performing (i.e.-CP's comment about the O-line earlier this season). It happens in our families, at work, etc. Not long after that statement, our O-line improved and possibly because they were called out. Who really knows. Maybe CP is hoping for the same response from Zorn...doubtful, and the wrong place to do it, but maybe he just thinks out loud too much.[/quote]

I have no problem with CP getting in teammates face (or coaches for that matter) in private. Once you take that crap to the media you become a punk.

Portis said (in regards to Zorn) "If you have a problem with me come talk to me" Take your own advice CP.

Also, that fact that he even said "I made no mistakes" is BS.... Remember your fumble CP? He comes across as a douche.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

I really wish TO (ooops, I meant Portis) would keep dissent out of the media. Go to Zorn, Stump Mitchell, his OLine or anyone else with his issues.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

CP is reminding me a little of Lavar here. Yes, you are the face of the Redskins. NO, that does not give you a licsense to go to the media and pout like a pussy. Sure, they treated you badly. Boo ****ing hoo. Now man up and join the team.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

[quote=maroonandblack30;510046]I have no problem with CP getting in teammates face (or coaches for that matter) in private. Once you take that crap to the media you become a punk.

Portis said (in regards to Zorn) "If you have a problem with me come talk to me" Take your own advice CP.

Also, that fact that he even said "I made no mistakes" is BS.... Remember your fumble CP? He comes across as a douche.[/quote]

So was Zorn a douche in every game that we lost? Because he has taken it upon himself to blast players for week now.

Re: Clinton Portis on the JT Show
 

Well it does seem as though Zorn was like well we're gonna lose this game so lets not injury him any further.