Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

I was soo pissed when I heard this trade. Now we cant trade with the Texans and it also means that Carr is on the Market. So now any other teams that might want to trade with us in order to get Quinn possibly wont now because they might want Carr instead.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

HA! i would doubt anyone would want Carr when they can draft the others.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

This isn't bad for the Skins, in my opinion. If someone wants to leap frog that sixth pick for CJ or whomever, you'd better believe they are going to pay one helluva price for it. Secondly, who said Carr was on the open market?

The kid just got an extension. If anything, they may go to camp and have an open QB competition...or at least they should. Why bring in a second stringer and anoint him starter without seeing the goods first? That would be incredibly presumptious on the Texans part if you ask me.

Bottom line, no one can take the sixth pick away from the Skins. All we have to do is play the waiting game.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

I though Atlanta was going to trade up to our spot at six in order to get Landry, but now it seems they are going to trade way way up and go after Calvin Johnson. I don't think Carr being available changes anything at the top of the draft. He is damaged goods and if Quinn goes before our pick it doesn't really matter anyways.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

Carr would be a great backup/3rd-stringer for us.

I disagree about no one wanting Carr though. When given a rare chance to throw, he's looked very good. Look at Andre Johnson's stats. His problem is that the Texans had the worst QB protection EVER. He spent most of time getting ground into the turf.

If given a good o-line, he could do very well. He has a very strong arm and I think a good football IQ. He just needs a chance to be able to use it. He was sacked 41 times last year and didn't get to play the full 16 games. He's been sacked 249 times in 5 years!

Carr sacked:

2006 = 41 times
2005 = 68
2004 = 49
2003 = 15 (12 games, only 295 pass attempts)
2002 = 76

No QB can produce with THAT.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

I don't like this deal for either team.

Houston: They have a good QB in Carr. However, he gets sacked and practically killed more than any other QB in the NFL. He'd do very well with an offensive line that can give him time to throw. They need to get an O-line before paying another QB because Schaub will get ground into the turf just like Carr. I would like to Carr get a chance to play somewhere else. He'll do well I think. He has a great arm and when given the rare chance to throw in Houston, did very well (don't believe me, look at Andre Johnson's stats).

Atlanta: The new coach said he's giving the ball to Vick and saying this is his year to prove if he can lead the team or not, "his last chance". Honestly, criminal activity and tabloid-like stories aside, I don't believe Vick will succeed. He's an incredible athlete, but not cut out to be a Super Bowl-winning QB, which is the goal of every owner in the NFL aside from Detroit. Also, Vick's best quality is his running ability, which carries a high risk for injury. I think they're really going to regret losing Schaub, the QB a lot of Falcon fans want to see lead the team in the future.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[QUOTE=Buster;290112]I don't like this deal for either team.

Houston: They have a good QB in Carr. However, he gets sacked and practically killed more than any other QB in the NFL. He'd do very well with an offensive line that can give him time to throw. They need to get an O-line before paying another QB because Schaub will get ground into the turf just like Carr. I would like to Carr get a chance to play somewhere else. He'll do well I think. He has a great arm and when given the rare chance to throw in Houston, did very well (don't believe me, look at Andre Johnson's stats).

Atlanta: The new coach said he's giving the ball to Vick and saying this is his year to prove if he can lead the team or not, "his last chance". Honestly, criminal activity and tabloid-like stories aside, I don't believe Vick will succeed. He's an incredible athlete, but not cut out to be a Super Bowl-winning QB, which is the goal of every owner in the NFL aside from Detroit. Also, Vick's best quality is his running ability, which carries a high risk for injury. [B]I think they're really going to regret losing Schaub, the QB a lot of Falcon fans want to see lead the team in the future.[/B][/QUOTE]

With all these extra picks the Falcons now have, Petrino might have his eye on a project QB in the draft this year. And I wouldn't feel too bad for Carr. Even if he loses the QB competition this year with Shaub, he'll get his chances elsewhere. Due to the Texans' dreadful O-line, I'd bet there are a number of people around the league who think Carr might have the goods if he could only get protection.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[QUOTE=BeastsoftheNFCeast;290103]I was soo pissed when I heard this trade. Now we cant trade with the Texans and it also means that Carr is on the Market. So now any other teams that might want to trade with us in order to get Quinn possibly wont now because they might want Carr instead.[/QUOTE]

Well, that presupposes Brady Quinn would fall to #6 -- I still think he'll be gone within the first 4 picks. No matter what sort of charade they're tossing up in Detroit about being satisfied with Jon Kitna, there's no way they pass on the promise of Brady Quinn.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

Carr has been shopped for a month with no takers. Obviously the excuse that he just has no line is not all there is to it. If he was any good, they'dhave gotten an offer, but they didn't.
Likely he's going to be cut, and anyone who wants to snatch him off the scrap heap will be able to do so.
So it really doesn't matter to us what happens there. If a team is content to go with him, nothing is going to change that. Depending on how round 1 shakes out, we still should have a plentiful supply of potential trade partners wanting to move up and get a guy they think won't be there for them.

~Bang

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[quote=Beemnseven;290119]Well, that presupposes Brady Quinn would fall to #6 -- I still think he'll be gone within the first 4 picks. No matter what sort of charade they're tossing up in Detroit about being satisfied with Jon Kitna, there's no way they pass on the promise of Brady Quinn.[/quote]That's definately true.

At #1, the Raiders have to decide between Russell, Quinn, and Johnson.
At #2, the Lions have to decide between Quinn, Johnson, and Joe Thomas
At #3, the Browns have to decide between, Russell, Quinn, Thomas, Adrian Peterson, and Johnson

The Bucs will take Johnson if hes there, but might take someone like Gaines Adams if he's gone.

The Cards would take Thomas (and I'm starting to think he'll be there for them), but may have to decide between defensive prospects including Landry, Gaines Adams, Leon Hall, and more recently, Patrick Willis.

Theres a good chance that Quinn gets by the Raiders, a good chance he gets by the Lions, a good chance he gets by the Browns, BUT when you add up all those probabilities, there is not a very good chance at all that he eeks by all three.

I STILL think the Raiders are going to take him. Obviously that team has a lot of other options though.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

I don't think it will hurt us much at all. I think we've got a deal with Denver already penciled in.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72;290151]I don't think it will hurt us much at all. I think we've got a deal with Denver already penciled in.[/QUOTE]

You think? For the 21st pick in the first round?

If you had to choose between getting one of the top guys available for the D-line, or fall all the way down to #21, lose out on those guys but pick up more picks in the second and the third, I'd just as soon stay at #6.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[quote=12thMan;290106]
The kid just got an extension. If anything, they may go to camp and have an open QB competition...or at least they should. Why bring in a second stringer and anoint him starter without seeing the goods first? That would be incredibly presumptious on the Texans part if you ask me.

.[/quote]


Theres no way that the Texans are giving up two 2nd round picks, droping two spots in the first round, and giving a 6 year $48 million contract to Schuab so they can have a QB competition. Carr will be gone next year and Sage Rosenfels will be groomed as Schuabs backup.

Also intresting note, the Falcons now have enough ammo to convince Detroit to trade out of the #2 spot. Not only would they be able to bring a profilic reciever into town but they'd also be keeping him away from a division rival (Tampa). Plus the fact that hes from Atlanta makes him all the more marketable for the locals.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

I think everyone is operating on about 10% info right now. There are going to be some serious shake ups in the coming weeks and trades will absolutely happen at the top of this draft this year.

It is nearly impossible to figure out. More so than ever before that I can remember.

I think this draft has some real quality players that people are desperate to get. The key is that we figure out how to capitalize on that. I don't want to be one of the desperate teams.

I wonder if we could package to move up and then repackage to move back down and end up getting who we want plus even better picks?

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[quote=Beemnseven;290159]You think? For the 21st pick in the first round?

If you had to choose between getting one of the top guys available for the D-line, or fall all the way down to #21, lose out on those guys but pick up more picks in the second and the third, I'd just as soon stay at #6.[/quote]

What if you were pick up #21, a 2nd, a 3rd, a 4th, and Bly... in exchange for #6 and Springs?

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[QUOTE=FRPLG;290164]I think everyone is operating on about 10% info right now. There are going to be some serious shake ups in the coming weeks and trades will absolutely happen at the top of this draft this year.

It is nearly impossible to figure out. More so than ever before that I can remember.

I think this draft has some real quality players that people are desperate to get. The key is that we figure out how to capitalize on that. I don't want to be one of the desperate teams.

I wonder if we could package to move up and then repackage to move back down and end up getting who we want plus even better picks?[/QUOTE]

I was wondering the same thing actually. How do we move up to 2-4 and then move back down again. Didn't we do something similar the Ricky Williams year?

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

that trade was and still is strange to me cuz we houston needed was and o-line not a another qb and to make matter worst he is slower that D.Carr. Carr is goin to be aight if he goes to another team that has a o-lne and some palymaker around his. I don't see another team tradin for him cuz they made it clear that Schaub is their qb and everyother team know that they want to trade carr befor tha draft so tha team are goin to fall back and wait till they release carr. so he is free to pick his team

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[quote=Mattyk72;290166]What if you were pick up a 2nd, 3rd, 4th, and Bly?[/quote]

That would be good, but remember those 2nd 3rd and 4th picks are late in their respective rounds, and although Bly is a quality player, we already have cap problems, and signing him will just further those problems. And we might not even need him if Rogers and Smoot turn out to be a good duo. I'm not saying thats not a fair deal, I'm just up in the air about it and playing the devils advocate because I feel we also really need to improve our D-line this year. I would honestly perfer draft picks going into next year over getting Bly.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

I like Carr, but he has to take some of the blame for his sacks. He has a tendency often to just hold onto the ball way too long.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;290160]Theres no way that the Texans are giving up two 2nd round picks, droping two spots in the first round, and giving a 6 year $48 million contract to Schuab so they can have a QB competition. Carr will be gone next year and Sage Rosenfels will be groomed as Schuabs backup...[/quote]I just can't believe we got nothing for Archuleta.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[quote=FRPLG;290164]I think everyone is operating on about 10% info right now. There are going to be some serious shake ups in the coming weeks and trades will absolutely happen at the top of this draft this year.

It is nearly impossible to figure out. More so than ever before that I can remember.

I think this draft has some real quality players that people are desperate to get. The key is that we figure out how to capitalize on that. I don't want to be one of the desperate teams.

I wonder if we could package to move up and then repackage to move back down and end up getting who we want plus even better picks?[/quote]Hopeful?

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[quote=Mattyk72;290151]I don't think it will hurt us much at all. I think we've got a deal with Denver already penciled in.[/quote]Does this 'pencil' have an eraser?

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72;290166]What if you were pick up #21, a 2nd, a 3rd, a 4th, and Bly... in exchange for #6 and Springs?[/QUOTE]

On the surface it sounds tempting, but as someone else pointed out, those are all late picks in each draft. Plus you have to consider our record in selecting players in the middle rounds of the draft that have amounted to anything.

If there was a shot at one of the top guys for the D-line at #21 (and by that I mean Branch, Okoye, Carriker, Jamaal Anderson or Gaines Adams), then I would take that deal and run. Problem is that none of these guys will last that long -- and we would still have big question marks with our front four.

Our ability to bolster the defensive line, even if it means doing it with just one player this year, trumps picking up additional picks in the late rounds.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[quote=Mattyk72;290166]What if you were pick up #21, a 2nd, a 3rd, a 4th, and Bly... in exchange for #6 and Springs?[/quote]
I think they'd be crazy not to do that deal. I think that as another said, they have a deal pencilled in, and it's waiting so Denver can see how the first few picks shake out.


The notion that any draft pick is a sure thing is absurd. Where you pick in round one is kind of meaningless. Yay, so we stay at 6 and pick a guy Mel Kiper thinks is good. Does that make him good automatically?
Heath Shuler, Michael Westbrook, LaVar Arrington.. should teach us a lesson about the 'sure things".

~Bang

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[quote=Mattyk72;290166]What if you were pick up #21, a 2nd, a 3rd, a 4th, and Bly... in exchange for #6 and Springs?[/quote]
man i hope your right. this would be a sweet deal for the skins

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[quote=Mattyk72;290166]What if you were pick up #21, a 2nd, a 3rd, a 4th, and Bly... in exchange for #6 and Springs?[/quote]What if?

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[quote=dmek25;290222]man i hope your right. this would be a sweet deal for the skins[/quote]

Pure speculation on my part of course, but I could see a deal similar to that going down.

How odd would it be to see Champ and Springs playing together?

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

2 recent reports should be noted here:

1) We traded AA to the Bears by getting them to pick up a 4.5 mil bonus.
2) It was reported that the Springs to Denver deal for Wilson & picks wasn't done because Denver wouldn't take on the cap relief the Skins asked for.

These are both great signs to me, the front office is finally refusing to eat all the cap hit in its deals. Whoever is ready to make a deal come draft day I hope is really desparate to pick someone at #6, otherwise we may not be able to play hardball as much if we want to acquire extra picks.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

Cassarely Sure did a great job of building the texans o-line huh???

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

I heard on ESPN or the NFL network that they thought the Falcons were interseted in Landry that's why they moved up.

This trade could hurt or help we will have to see, I still think we will be sitting in a very good position when we are on the clock with the 6th pick, someone will fall and something will get done. Right now we should have a legitamate interest in every player, I would also be in contact with teams who want Quinn we could very well force someone's hand to move up to our spot if they really want him, he has a legitamate chance of falling to us at the 6th spot.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

i wouldnt mind the denver trade but we need to stay close to #6 to get adams... we need a pass rusher on the line. it's tought to call becuz 4 picks and bly is tempting as hell

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[quote=PWNED;290105]HA! i would doubt anyone would want Carr when they can draft the others.[/quote]

The sad thing is Matt Schaub is going to suck there too, but it wont be his fault. I dont know why they continue to neglect there offensive line the way they do, Im sure David Carr is ready to get out of there anyways. I think David Carr is going to be much better for another team anyways, possibly detroit or maybe even minnesota where they dont know much about Tavaris Jackson.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[quote=GiantsSuck703;290322]The sad thing is Matt Schaub is going to suck there too, but it wont be his fault. I dont know why they continue to neglect there offensive line the way they do, Im sure David Carr is ready to get out of there anyways. I think David Carr is going to be much better for another team anyways, possibly detroit or maybe even minnesota where they dont know much about Tavaris Jackson.[/quote]I don't know how good Schaub is going to be there, but one thing I do know is that if David Carr can complete 69% in Kubiak's system, so can Schaub.

Schaub is a lock for 66% completion, 6.5 yards/attempt, and 15 TDs. I bet he gets picked 9 times or less. That's a pretty solid fantasy sleeper, IMO.

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[quote=Meks;290308]i wouldnt mind the denver trade but we need to stay close to #6 to get adams... we need a pass rusher on the line. it's tought to call becuz 4 picks and bly is tempting as hell[/quote]

4 picks is actually almost better to me than 4 picks + Bly. If there was no cap I wouldn't say that, but I wonder what Bly's expectations are? over 10mil bonus at least I bet. I don't think Denver ever offered 4 picks, I thought it was 3 in exchange for our #1, thus a net gain of 2. I remember one scenario that included a late round pick, which definitely is only gravy.

If we got a 2nd & 3rd or 2 2nds it'd be tought to pass up. we need some picks!

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

[QUOTE=offiss;290303]I heard on ESPN or the NFL network that they thought the Falcons were interseted in Landry that's why they moved up.

This trade could hurt or help we will have to see, I still think we will be sitting in a very good position when we are on the clock with the 6th pick, someone will fall and something will get done. Right now we should have a legitamate interest in every player, I would also be in contact with teams who want Quinn we could very well force someone's hand to move up to our spot if they really want him, he has a legitamate chance of falling to us at the 6th spot.[/QUOTE]

I hear the Panthers are also interested so...

The #6 to the the Panthers for their 1st (14), 2nd (45), 3rd (83) and um...Julius Peppers

But seriously, that could be another trade partner potentially

Re: Schaub Trade bad for skins
 

I'd like to be sitting at number 14 in the 1st and second round. I think we could find one good dline man. Karriker, Okoye, Moss at the 14 spot. With a good G in the second round. Maybe even an upgrade over Doc.