Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=mlmpetert;921055]This is very dificult topic/issue:

[url=http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/06/12/study-finds-host-challenges-for-kids-gay-parents/?intcmp=features]Study finds host of challenges for kids of gay parents | Fox News[/url]


[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]But I think the author summed it up perfectly and basically states exactly how i feel.[/FONT][/COLOR]
[/quote]

[quote=firstdown;921198]From what I read Fox had nothing to do with the survey they just reported the finding after they were published. The survey Fox used was current with thousands of people and the one you posted is much older and done with only 500 people.[/quote]


[quote=mlmpetert;921236]I think you need to overcome your biases.


[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana][U]And that is just what the Fox News [I]opinion[/I] piece was about, impartialness in research and reporting[/U]. Its wasnt a summary of a study, like WebMD reported 6 years ago. It was about the ethical delima of researching, studying and reporting on uncommfortable and politically incorrect topics when relating to the well-being of our childern. Im not sure if you read it but the tune of his piece can be captured with this paragraph:[/FONT][/COLOR]



[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Look, I think The Gays (quoting gawker) are great. I really do. I think they are entitled to the exact same things as the non gays. But I think discretion should always be used to enforce the well being of a child who the state has taken control over. I hope one day everyone loves each other, theres peace in the Middle East, both gays and nongays [I][FONT=Verdana]cant[/FONT][/I] get married and everything else that will make this world perfect, but in the meantime i think we should be realistic and use discretion. [/FONT][/COLOR]

Research shouldnt be silienced if it conflicts with political correctness. If Fair and Balanced actually means being fair and balanced than Fox News is by far the leader in presenting voices from all sides. If watching Fox News means a commitment to practice impartialality then count me in! Being open minded is a 2 way street.[/quote]


Don't think for a moment I forgot about you two.


In regards to that bogus survey and research that was done, let me address this.

[url=http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/12/gay-parents-study-kids-social-scientists_n_1589177.html]Gay Parents Study Suggesting Downside For Kids Draws Fire From Social Scientists[/url]


[quote] But other scientists say the research is deeply flawed, and does not measure the effect of same-sex parenting at all. The study defined same-sex parenting by asking participants if their parents had ever had same-sex relationships, and whether they had lived with the parent at that time. That led to a "hodgepodge" group of people who Regnerus then compared with kids in stable, married homes, said Judith Stacey, a sociologist at New York University who was not involved in the research.

"He doesn't have an actual category of gay parents in the project that you can isolate and say the most important thing in this kid's childhood is that they were raised by gay parents," Stacey told LiveScience. "These are kids whose parents, maybe they divorced, maybe they separated, maybe they had a scandalous affair, we just don't know.[/quote]



Not enough? Let's move to this. Let's let this title sink in.


[B][SIZE="5"]Controversial UT study found inaccurate by [U]publisher[/U][/SIZE][/B]

[url=http://www.dailytexanonline.com/university/2012/07/27/controversial-ut-study-found-inaccurate-publisher]Controversial UT study found inaccurate by publisher | The Daily Texan[/url]


[quote]Social Science Research, the sociology journal who published Regnerus’ study, conducted the audit and found the peer-review process used to evaluate the study failed to identify “significant, disqualifying problems” with the study and highlights conflicts of interest between the study’s peer-reviewers, according to audit documents obtained by The Chronicle of Higher Education. James Wright, Social Science Journal editor, said he ordered the inquiry into the study to protect the journal’s credibility due to skepticism from academic professionals about the study’s validity.

“These are professionals in the field, people I know and respect,” Wright said in an interview with The Daily Texan. “It became obvious that to protect the credibility of myself and the journal, rather than me trying to answer these questions, I should simply ask somebody other then me to undertake an audit and issue a report.”[/quote]

[B]TAKE THAT BEMBRIDGE SCHOLARS![/B]

[IMG]http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lssrmxcLbg1qf7mv2o1_500.gif[/IMG]

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

Conclusion. The bigots and fundies can continue their bogus research to propagate fallacies in regards to the LBGT community, but it doesn't make it accurate nor acceptable. Not to mention that his funding came from a conservative organization. Puts things into perspective. This clown should never be allowed to publish anything ever again. Period.



Edit: here is additional info on Mark Regnerus bogus "study".


From one of the comments on that article:


[quote]

I have been one of Dr. Regnerus' stiffest critics as I have been following this since Sunday June 10th the day before it became publicly available for free on line on Monday June 11th.

He e-mailed me that he didn't find but two respondents who said that they had been raised by mommy+mommy for 18 years. I believe I was the first and last member of the public Dr. Regnerus corresponded with via e-mail.
[url]http://www.boxturtlebulletin.c[/url]...

One item in this article interest me and that is this quote,

"Wright said the audit will be published in the November issue of Social Science Research and expects to receive updated information on the study from Regnerus in response to recent criticism.

“He has done some re-analysis based on some of the various criticisms of how he handled the data on the first go around,” Wright said."

IF Dr. Regnerus collaborates with qualified Social Scientists with expertise in sexual minority research on his second go around I will be satisfied. What I want is for the first paper to be deleted and replaced by a second paper. I want that first paper GONE!

He has to scrub his data and get rid off all the records where the people answered that their mother was 80 years old when they were born, and that they had 22 abortions, and that they weigh under 80lbs, and other really weird answers.

He has to use a population of sexual minorities that match the 2010 census. What he did was overload the recordset with Sexual Minorities who are African American and Hispanic. The overloading of Hispanic Lesbians is particularity damaging because Hispanic Lesbians receive public assistance at 3 times the rate of other lesbains.

If he collaborates with a social science researcher that has expertise in sexual minority research, if he scrubs his data, if he has a survey population that matches the 2010 Census in race and ethnicity, and he retracts his GOLD STANDARD mommy+daddy comments, I will have no further issues with Dr. Regnerus.

Look in this Culture War we are not going to let you win by lying. If either side is going to win, it has to be a win based on the truth. That is all I have ever expected from Dr. Regnerus, the truth. And as a Professor at the University of Texas Austin that is what I expect from him, the truth. As long as he makes scientifically valid statements and conclusions based on research data, I have no problems.
[/quote]

So, are we done with this false mythology about gay parenting?

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

My brother was in town and the whole CFA thing came up. I completely forgot but my brother used to work there. It was a combo CFA and Pizza Hut in Virginia Tech when he went to school there. He said that he has never had Pizza Hut since working there and seeing first hand what went into pizzas, but continues to eat CFA because how well made the stuff was.

Nothing you order from CFA (not sure about fries though?) is older then 5 minutes. Everything has a timer put on it and if hits the 5 minute mark it goes in the trash. Fresh chicken is hand cut every day. Quality is the most important thing there.

Also i thought this was neat. My brother used to be an electrical engineer and his company was contracted to design some stuff for a CFA building. Written into the contract was that none of the engineering work can be done on Sundays. I think CFA employees get paid higher than most of ther fast food places. Its not open on those pesky Christian Holidays.

Again i never had CHA until about 2 years ago. If you havent had it before i would highly suggest giving it a shot. REALLY GOOD.


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OwZGmYV-1I]Tim Hawkins - Chick-fil-A Song (New Verse) - YouTube[/ame]

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

I'm not against gay parenting but for people to say they don't have additional challenges just goes beyond logic.

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[URL="http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2012/08/massive-lines-at-chick-fil-a-on-national-chick-fil-a-appreciation-day-2/chick-fil-a/"][IMG]http://thegatewaypundit.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/chick-fil-a-e1343844363840.jpg[/IMG][/URL]

[URL="http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2012/08/massive-lines-at-chick-fil-a-on-national-chick-fil-a-appreciation-day/chick-texas/"][IMG]http://thegatewaypundit.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/chick-texas-e1343847469273.jpg[/IMG][/URL]

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=Mattyk;925493]I don't have any in my area, but if I did I'd sure as hell boycott them.[/quote]

Cool...then I'm going to buy stock in Chic-Fil-A...lol!

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=Mattyk;925493]I don't have any in my area, but if I did I'd sure as hell boycott them.[/quote]
Well that's your right but we all know your going to sneek a few when no ones looking.

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

never ate there. not because of any particular reason

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

I still don't understand why a company needs to have a stance on gay marriage.

Chicken with a side of homophobes, what a combo.

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=Mattyk;928159]I still don't understand why a company needs to have a stance on gay marriage.

Chicken with a side of homophobes, what a combo.[/quote]

I agree 100%. I actually think discrimination laws in general are pretty stuppid. I perfer to know who I'm doing business and if they don't like my race, etc... I want to know up front so I don't spend my money with them. With the way the laws are set up now I don't know.

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=Mattyk;928159]I still don't understand why a company needs to have a stance on gay marriage.

Chicken with a side of homophobes, what a combo.[/quote]


[IMG]http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/599631_502702466425878_2012630268_n.jpg[/IMG]

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=firstdown;927411]I'm not against gay parenting but for people to say they don't have additional challenges just goes beyond logic.[/quote]

What additional challenges beyond other people's bigotry and hatred do they have? So they shouldn't be parents because bigotry and hatred exist? So we should conform to the bigots instead of the other way around?


I still see you and mlmpetert had nothing to say about that bogus study being exposed. I assume both of your silence means point noted and accepted.

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=Mattyk;928159]I still don't understand why a company needs to have a stance on gay marriage.

Chicken with a side of homophobes, what a combo.[/quote]Companies generally don't have a stand on gay marriage, but with the 24x7 instant media coverage of everything things like this will happen. Good for D.C. standing by his beliefs.

BTW, Chick-fil-A had a "record setting" day yesterday.

The point is politicans like Rahm Emanuel and the Mayor of Boston have no right to discriminate against a company based on the religious or political views of its CEO. The company does not discriminate or violate any regulations for EEO. Wonder how the left's panties would get bunched if Starbucks or Nabisco was targeted by a local government for their stance on gay marriage.

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=NC_Skins;928166]What additional challenges beyond other people's bigotry and hatred do they have? So they shouldn't be parents because bigotry and hatred exist? So we should conform to the bigots instead of the other way around?


[B]I still see you and mlmpetert had nothing to say about that bogus study being exposed. I assume both of your silence means point noted and accepted[/B].[/quote]


Dont think for a moment i forgot about you either!!!

Sike, im just kiding. Point noted. You win. But unfortunitly winning in the Debating With The Enemy section of thewarpath is like getting a box of Chicken McBites from McDonalds. Losing means you get 2 boxes of Chicken McBites.....

I wasnt answearing you because you hadnt answeared my question from before, and i happen to be very petty about that kind of stuff.

So:

[quote]Let me ask you something personally. In your opinion would a male teen raised by 2 dads in one of the most uneducated, ignorant and bigoted parts of NC, say Greenville*, be subject to more or less adversity than an otherwise similar kid with no gay parents? Same situation but in SoCal?[/quote]

And you left out parts from the rest of my post, which if anyone would like to see you can click on [URL="http://www.thewarpath.net/debating-with-the-enemy/47747-north-carolina-passes-same-sex-marriage-10.html#post921236"]THIS RIGHT HERE![/URL].


And partly because it sums up the way i feel, but more so just because i like quoting myself (and of course citing FoxNewsTotallyAwesome):

[quote]This is very dificult topic/issue:

[URL="http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/06/12/study-finds-host-challenges-for-kids-gay-parents/?intcmp=features"][COLOR=#0066cc]Study finds host of challenges for kids of gay parents | Fox News[/COLOR][/URL]


[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]But I think the author summed it up perfectly and basically states exactly how i feel.[/FONT][/COLOR]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]I have a step brother and sister that are adopted and i feel like if the state becomes involved at any point (foster care) it has to take ownership in the well being of the child. Allowing a gay person or couple to adopt a kid in NYC is different than letting a gay male couple adopt a kid in NC_Skin's town of Greenville, no matter how unfortunate that may be. So i guess im trying to say discretion should be used. [/FONT][/COLOR]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]If its a private adoption or international adoption i think the issue is a lot trickier. It becomes a civil rights issue vs a child welfare issue.[/FONT][/COLOR] [/quote]


[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]In a perfect world i dont think we should ever conform to bigots or haters, but my vision of a perfect world doesnt have any bigots or haters to conform to. In a imperfect world i think we have to use discretion when the well being of a child is involved (espicially after the state had already become involved). Children shouldnt be used to combat bigotry.[/FONT][/COLOR]

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=mlmpetert;925461][URL="http://radio.foxnews.com/toddstarnes/top-stories/chick-fil-a-president-says-company-opposes-gay-marriage.html"]UPDATE: Chick-fil-A Responds to Criticism Over Gay Marriage Opposition | FOX News & Commentary: Todd Starnes[/URL]

I dont agree with Chic Fil a's views but im thinking this will have an overall benefit on business. If they were public i would be buying some futures. I got to think that this rallies just as many as it alienates, and perhaps ralies many more.

Coincedently I had some chicken minies this morning and they were awesome as usual. I may even get a chicken strips spicy dressing salad for dinner tonight, just because i cant stop thinking about how good it is now.

[B]NCSkins are you boycotting Chic Fil a over[/B] [B]this?[/B][/quote]


I just realized you skipped out on 2 of my questions! DAMN IT!!!

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

Also for those who have never gone to CFA before something a little funny they normally do is say "my pleasure" instead of youre welcome or no problem.

[QUOTE]mlmpetert: Hi! May i please have a delicious chicken sandwich and one of your awesome Oreo milkshakes?

CFA girl: Absolutely! Anything else?

mlmpetert: No thats all. Thank you very much!

CFA girl: My pleasure![/QUOTE]

Its kind of wierd at first, but then you get used to it and appreciate it. Whats really wierd is they started saying my pleasure at Taco Bells around here. I havent gotten used to that yet.

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[QUOTE=Slingin Sammy 33;928209]

BTW, Chick-fil-A had a "record setting" day yesterday.

QUOTE]

Not really, yes in NC,SC,Texas......but not here in maryland,so take it for what it is worth.Point of fact...Chick-fil-A.....didn't have a veiw ...the owner did but most of the resturants are franchises and had to deal with the fallout.Problem is this isn't the first time he has done this ,he has made some questionable donations to certan groups that have also brought negative attention to the company.


[url=http://www.advocate.com/business/2012/07/19/chick-fil-touts-bible-and-antigay-donations-statement]Chick-fil-A Touts Bible and Antigay Donations in Statement | Advocate.com[/url]

In the new statement, the PR leader still reiterates the importance of the company's "biblically-based principles" and even brags about sending "a percentage of our profits back to our communities." [I]Equality Matters[/I] first exposed Chick-fil-A for actually donating millions to antigay groups including the Family Research Council and the Marriage and Family Foundation. [URL="http://www.advocate.com/business/2012/07/02/chick-fil-donates-2-mil-antigay-groups"][COLOR=#0066cc]In 2010 alone[/COLOR][/URL], it gave $2 million to antigay groups.

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=mlmpetert;928223]But unfortunitly winning in the Debating With The Enemy section of thewarpath is like getting a box of Chicken McBites from McDonalds. Losing means you get 2 boxes of Chicken McBites.....[/quote]

Not really about winning anything, but informing people of things they might not understand or know. Ignorance is a lock, knowledge is the key.



[quote]Let me ask you something personally. In your opinion would a male teen raised by 2 dads in one of the most uneducated, ignorant and bigoted parts of NC, say Greenville*, be subject to more or less adversity than an otherwise similar kid with no gay parents? Same situation but in SoCal? [/quote]

The reason this wasn't answered because the answer really doesn't matter. My guess is that they would be subjected to more adversity, but that means nothing in the grand scheme of it. The fact is, bigotry and hate is wrong, regardless if people's religion says so. Should blacks move out of the south because more racism tends to exist there? When we start conforming to the people who are in the wrong, is when our country will go to hell in a hand basket. Want to see how F'd up religion will destroy your country, look at Iran and many of the Middle Eastern countries with radical Islam.

You have to make a stand at some point against your oppressors. It happened with women's rights. It happened with rights for African Americans...and the fight will continue for equal rights among all human beings regardless of their race, religion, or sexual preference.


[quote=mlmpetert;928223][COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]In a perfect world i dont think we should ever conform to bigots or haters, but my vision of a perfect world doesnt have any bigots or haters to conform to. In a imperfect world i think we have to use discretion when the well being of a child is involved (espicially after the state had already become involved). Children shouldnt be used to combat bigotry.[/FONT][/COLOR][/quote]

Absolutely not. Your logic of backing down because bigotry exists doesn't make sense and all it does is negatively enforce the bigots actions that his bigotry makes a impact so he will continue on. Should black people not have children since racism exists? That's about the logic you are trying to use (or so it appears). Your assertion that children shouldn't be used to combat bigotry is off base, and assumes/implies that gay couples will run out and adopt just to fight for their rights.

[url=http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2012/07/30/church-that-barred-black-wedding-affirms-commitment-to-equal-treatment/]Church that barred black wedding affirms commitment to equal treatment – CNN Belief Blog - CNN.com Blogs[/url]

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;928209]The point is politicans like Rahm Emanuel and the Mayor of Boston have no right to discriminate against a company based on the [U]religious or political views of its CEO[/U]. The company does not discriminate or violate any regulations for EEO. Wonder how the left's panties would get bunched if Starbucks or Nabisco was targeted by a local government for their stance on gay marriage.[/quote]


When you actively fund groups that lobby against the gay community, it's no longer "[I]just a view[/I]." At that point, I believe that they should deny these companies right the to do business in their area if they see fit.



I posted this on facebook the other day and the message applies greatly here.

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/KJQDa.jpg[/IMG]

Most of the religious conservatives don't want the government to interfere in their lives, but have no problem insisting it does so in other people's lives. Irony. Hypocritical. Asinine.

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=mlmpetert;925461]NCSkins are you boycotting Chic Fil a over this?[/quote]

If I were to boycott everything that I stood against, chances are I wouldn't spend any of my money ever again.


[U][B]Banks[/B][/U] - part of the biggest swindle in US history. (legally at that)
[B][U]Corporation[/U][/B]- responsible for injecting money into politics to help favor their business models and avoid taxes.
[U][B]Oil[/B][/U] - a good bit of our oil comes from OPEC which is comprised of countries, who support inhumane religious practices and beliefs.


Chances are, I can find something that a company funds that I don't agree with. That said, I don't go to chick-fil-a often as is, but I have no problem staying away from them either.

Also, I find it sad that christians can go out of their way to support anti-gay measures, yet can't do the same for say...homeless people or other individuals in need. Which would you consider a pressing issue?


One more for the lulz:


[IMG]http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/391428_336403753114001_1063401171_n.jpg[/IMG]

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote]Not really, yes in NC,SC,Texas......but not here in maryland,so take it for what it is worth.Point of fact...Chick-fil-A.....didn't have a veiw ...the owner did but most of the resturants are franchises and had to deal with the fallout.Problem is this isn't the first time he has done this ,he has made some questionable donations to certan groups that have also brought negative attention to the company.


[URL="http://www.advocate.com/business/2012/07/19/chick-fil-touts-bible-and-antigay-donations-statement"]Chick-fil-A Touts Bible and Antigay Donations in Statement | Advocate.com[/URL]

In the new statement, the PR leader still reiterates the importance of the company's "biblically-based principles" and even brags about sending "a percentage of our profits back to our communities." [I]Equality Matters[/I] first exposed Chick-fil-A for actually donating millions to antigay groups including the Family Research Council and the Marriage and Family Foundation. [URL="http://www.advocate.com/business/2012/07/02/chick-fil-donates-2-mil-antigay-groups"][COLOR=#0066cc]In 2010 alone[/COLOR][/URL], it gave $2 million to antigay groups.[/quote]
Downplay it if you want, but the pictures from CFAs nationwide don't lie. Here in VA, lines were around the store and up the street...and the customers were diverse.

From your link, CFA corporate statement: "The Chick-fil-A culture and service tradition in our restaurants is to treat every person with honor, dignity and respect — regardless of their belief, race, creed, sexual orientation or gender," said the [URL="http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/07/19/chick-fil-a-and-gay-marriage-a-social-media-storm/"][COLOR=#000080]statement provided to CNN[/COLOR][/URL] by spokesman Don Perry. "We will continue this tradition in the over 1,600 Restaurants run by independent Owner/Operators. Going forward, our intent is to leave the policy debate over same-sex marriage to the government and political arena."


CFA isn't ashamed or trying to hide their donations to FRC and MFA, nor should they be. Equality Matters exposed nothing. If being sound on one's principles makes for "record-setting" sales......I'm sure CFA would like to be more exposed by Equality Matters.

If folks don't want to eat there because of the owner's religious views....then don't. If people don't want to frequent Starbucks or buy Nabisco because they are "anti-traditional marriage"....then they shouldn't. My point is gov't doesn't have any right to discriminate against a business because of the owner's beliefs....PERIOD.

A majority in this country don't support gay "marriage". Many who don't support gay "marriage" couldn't give a rat's hind-quarters about civil unions or what folks do on their own time between consenting adults. Because someone doesn't support gay marriage doesn't mean he/she is a homophobe or anti-gay. What works in NY & CA doesn't work in KS, SC, TX, the gay marriage debate is something to be decided by states.

BTW, should pro-choice folks be labeled as "anti-unborn child". Same-old, same-old double standards from the left.

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=NC_Skins;928260]Not really about winning anything, but informing people of things they might not understand or know. Ignorance is a lock, knowledge is the key.[/quote]

Okay fair enough. And dont get me wrong. McDonald's line up of[URL="http://www.seriouseats.com/2011/07/new-mcnugget-sauces-from-mcdonalds-review.html"] new sauces are awesome[/URL], im not knocking those at all. I just think their McBites suck.




[quote]The reason this wasn't answered because the answer really doesn't matter. My guess is that they would be subjected to more adversity, but that means nothing in the grand scheme of it. The fact is, bigotry and hate is wrong, regardless if people's religion says so. Should blacks move out of the south because more racism tends to exist there? When we start conforming to the people who are in the wrong, is when our country will go to hell in a hand basket. Want to see how F'd up religion will destroy your country, look at Iran and many of the Middle Eastern countries with radical Islam.[/quote]

Im not saying anything about people being forced to move from one place to another or not be protected at all costs when attacked. And I HATE Iran. But only because Fox told me too.

[quote]You have to make a stand at some point against your oppressors. It happened with women's rights. It happened with rights for African Americans...and the fight will continue for equal rights among all human beings regardless of their race, religion, or sexual preference.[/quote]

Could not agree more.


[quote]Absolutely not. Your logic of backing down because bigotry exists doesn't make sense and all it does is negatively enforce the bigots actions that his bigotry makes a impact so he will continue on. Should black people not have children since racism exists? That's about the logic you are trying to use (or so it appears). Your assertion that children shouldn't be used to combat bigotry is off base, and assumes/implies that gay couples will run out and adopt just to fight for their rights.[/quote]

Youre not hearing (reading?) what im saying (typing?).

Me:

If the state has taken custody of a kid, via foster care or some other means, it has the responsibility to protect the welfare the child above everything else before remitting control, even if it means compromising the liberty of others. The kids liberty comes first and above all other involved parties.

Examples:

A couple wants to adopt a little kid via public adoption.

Reasons to exercise caution:

1) The person/couple is gay and lives in Greenville NC

2) The person/couple has a pool or train tracks in their back yard

3) The person/couple lives in a particularly dangerous area and refuses to move

4) The person/couple lives with a felon

5) The person/couple practices a religion that excludes certain types of medial treatment

6) The person/couple wants to use the child as a spokes model to fight bigotry

Reasons not to to use additional caution:

1) The immediate and foreseeable living conditions of the person/couple present no obvious "adversity" or harm to the child

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=NC_Skins;928267]If I were to boycott everything that I stood against, chances are I wouldn't spend any of my money ever again.


[U][B]Banks[/B][/U] - part of the biggest swindle in US history. (legally at that)
[B][U]Corporation[/U][/B]- responsible for injecting money into politics to help favor their business models and avoid taxes.
[U][B]Oil[/B][/U] - a good bit of our oil comes from OPEC which is comprised of countries, who support inhumane religious practices and beliefs.


Chances are, I can find something that a company funds that I don't agree with. That said, I don't go to chick-fil-a often as is, but I have no problem staying away from them either.

Also, I find it sad that christians can go out of their way to support anti-gay measures, [B]yet can't do the same for say...homeless people or other individuals in need. Which would you consider a pressing issue?[/B]


One more for the lulz:


[IMG]http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/391428_336403753114001_1063401171_n.jpg[/IMG][/quote]

Thats just one stupid statement from a totally stupid post. You really think that churches do nothing to feed the hiomeless? Who do you think supports and pays for most soup kitchens. It seem you need to get out and voluter some and see how much churches actuall y do to help the community.


[URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soup_kitchen"]Soup kitchen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/URL]


I see you have problems with Companies donating money to politicians. Do you have the same problem with unions that do the same thing?

Whats the swindle of the banks?

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=NC_Skins;928166]What additional challenges beyond other [B]people's bigotry and hatred do they have[/B]? So they shouldn't be parents because bigotry and hatred exist? So we should conform to the bigots instead of the other way around?


I still see you and mlmpetert had nothing to say about that bogus study being exposed. I assume both of your silence means point noted and accepted.[/quote]

You made my point. I never said if it was right or wrong I just said they have additional chalanges.

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=firstdown;928282]Thats just one stupid statement from a totally stupid post. You really think that churches do nothing to feed the hiomeless? Who do you think supports and pays for most soup kitchens. It seem you need to get out and voluter some and see how much churches actuall y do to help the community.[/quote]

First off, I've never claimed that churches didn't help people, nor did I say they didn't help feed the needy so not sure how you pulled that out of what I said. I said it's a shame they can't "go out of their way" to help the homeless like this. If I'm wrong about that, can you please show me where any lines were 3 hours long or cars backed up for miles just to help out the homeless and needy? I'll pull up a chair and wait on this...

[IMG]http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/292319_10150927580966642_629690956_n.jpg[/IMG]
FYI: I grew up in a christian home, I live in the bible belt, I went to a private christian school.




[quote][URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soup_kitchen"]Soup kitchen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/URL]
[/quote]

What is this posted for? I know what a soup kitchen is. You got any numbers of how many hours and money are put in by the church as opposed to non-church? I'll wait patiently.


[quote=firstdown;928282]I see you have problems with Companies donating money to politicians. Do you have the same problem with unions that do the same thing?

Whats the swindle of the banks?[/quote]

Well, unions are there to help the workers fight off baron robbers. That said, I think unions can be, at times, destructive and inefficient in the grand scheme of things. I think you missed the whole point. The whole point was for me to list a few basic things that encompass our daily spending(gas, goods, savings) that are used for things we may not endorse. It's not that complicated, but if you would like me to submit a 20 page document, than I'll need you to pay pal me some money over for my time. :)

You seriously need me to tell you what the banks did?...lol Bailouts? Look at what's going on in the UK with LIBOR. Common man!

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=firstdown;928284]You made my point. I never said if it was right or wrong I just said they have additional chalanges.[/quote]

Well, a handicap person has additional challenges. Females have additional challenges. Minorities have additional challenges. Not sure what point you are trying to make that kids growing up a homosexual home have additional challenges. That's kind of a obvious statement captain. Are you implying that because they have additional challenges that it is a legit reason for gay couples to not be parents?

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=mlmpetert;928280]Im not saying anything about people being forced to move from one place to another or not be protected at all costs when attacked. And I HATE Iran. But only because Fox told me too.[/quote]

Not sure why the hate for Iran. Did you know that Iran was once a country on the rise in terms of civilization, much like we were back in the 60's and 70s?

[url=http://iransnews.wordpress.com/2011/07/10/iran-in-1960s-and-1970s/]Iran in 1960s and 1970s « News About Iran[/url]

Our CIA and foreign policy put a stop to all that. That is something Fox News isn't going to tell you.



[quote=mlmpetert;928280]Youre not hearing (reading?) what im saying (typing?).

Me:

If the state has taken custody of a kid, via foster care or some other means, it has the responsibility to protect the welfare the child above everything else before remitting control, even if it means compromising the liberty of others. The kids liberty comes first and above all other involved parties.

Examples:

A couple wants to adopt a little kid via public adoption.

Reasons to exercise caution:

1) The person/couple is gay and lives in Greenville NC

2) The person/couple has a pool or train tracks in their back yard
[B]
3) The person/couple lives in a particularly dangerous area and refuses to move[/B]
[B]
4) The person/couple lives with a felon[/B]

[B]5) The person/couple practices a religion that excludes certain types of medial treatment[/B]

6) The person/couple wants to use the child as a spokes model to fight bigotry

Reasons not to to use additional caution:

1) The immediate and foreseeable living conditions of the person/couple present no obvious "adversity" or harm to the child[/quote]

Three out of your six are legitimate concerns I suppose, but the other three are equivalent to playing the straw man card. Nobody is going to get a kid to fight bigotry, they have protests and other legal actions for that. No need to get a kid who's going to create a ton of expense to champion the cause. Number one is so far off base and out of touch with the reality of things. Again, racism is still alive and deep rooted in the south so would they let any family adopt a black kid in Greenville, NC because of the potential hostility and racism shown? They aren't going to base adoption of something such as that. You are basically suggesting what I mentioned prior.

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

This is really becoming so silly, its insane to see how this country is so media driven. Its really amazing.

Its rare we get to hear what companies support outside the business world unless its a charitable organization, I think lessen learned from Oreo's maker and Chickfila is to keep quiet. I dont mind when people or corporation use their first admendant right, even if I dont agree, but I sick of the god damn media and talking heads on cable and radio driving their extreme, hate filled rhetoric home.These people dont want to talk about the legit issue, they just want to throw punches. We get suckered into it and Chickfila in the end gets paid.

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

Video of CFAs in Springfield, Falls Church and Crystal City. AND theres a pretty hot chick right after the 3 minute mark.

[URL="http://www.mrctv.org/videos/checking-out-chick-fil-appreciation-day"]Checking Out Chick-fil-A 'Appreciation Day' | MRCTV[/URL]

Yesterday’s “Chick-fil-A Appreciation Day” was huge across the country. MRCTV’s Dan Joseph and crew traveled to several Chick-fil-A locations around the DC area to interview some of the many Americans who came to support traditional marriage and freedom of speech.

“It’s a shame we can’t say what we think these days,” protested one woman. Another added, “We’re protesting, you know, the media and everybody trying to say it’s hate. I don’t hate anybody.” Joseph even found a huge line in Springfield, Virginia at 2 pm – hardly the lunch rush:

Read more: [url=http://newsbusters.org/blogs/tim-graham/2012/08/02/mrctv-films-chick-fil-crowds-favor-free-speech-against-media-hate-labels#ixzz22UNeO1iC]MRCTV Films at Chick-fil-A: Crowds In Favor of Free Speech, Against Media 'Hate' Labels | NewsBusters.org[/url]

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

God's Will?

[url=http://www.freep.com/article/20120728/BUSINESS07/120728005/Chick-fil-A-spokesman-dies-amid-furor-over-same-sex-marriage]Chick-fil-A spokesman dies amid furor over same-sex marriage | Nation/world Business | Detroit Free Press | freep.com[/url]

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

Good read:

[url=http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2012/08/02/i-support-justin-durant-and-chick-fil-a/]I Support Justin Durant And Chick-Fil-A « CBS Detroit[/url]

[QUOTE]Let me take this opportunity to applaud Lions linebacker Justin Durant. First of all, he made me laugh. Someone on Durant’s Twitter asked him if he would stop eating at Chick-Fil-A if the owner supported slavery. He tweeted back: “Chicken too tasty.” Good joke, and excellent use of fighting hyperbole with humor.[/QUOTE]

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=NC_Skins;928292]First off, I've never claimed that churches didn't help people, nor did I say they didn't help feed the needy so not sure how you pulled that out of what I said. I said it's a shame they can't "go out of their way" to help the homeless like this. If I'm wrong about that, can you please show me where any lines were 3 hours long or cars backed up for miles just to help out the homeless and needy? I'll pull up a chair and wait on this...

[IMG]http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/292319_10150927580966642_629690956_n.jpg[/IMG]
FYI: I grew up in a christian home, I live in the bible belt, I went to a private christian school.






What is this posted for? I know what a soup kitchen is. You got any numbers of how many hours and money are put in by the church as opposed to non-church? I'll wait patiently.




Well, unions are there to help the workers fight off baron robbers. That said, I think unions can be, at times, destructive and inefficient in the grand scheme of things. I think you missed the whole point. The whole point was for me to list a few basic things that encompass our daily spending(gas, goods, savings) that are used for things we may not endorse. It's not that complicated, but if you would like me to submit a 20 page document, than I'll need you to pay pal me some money over for my time. :)

You seriously need me to tell you what the banks did?...lol Bailouts? Look at what's going on in the UK with LIBOR. Common man![/quote]

You have never been to a BBQ to raise money for a church which feeds the poor. People pack churches every week and they pass a tray to make donations. Hell just 3 months back we had over 500 people waiting in lines to buy food and beer to help the poor. Having a golf event on Sept 7 which will have around 140 golfers at $100 a man to raise money for the poor. I could a 100 pages on people gathering to help rais money for the poor so you can quit waiting. Maybe you should try joing an organization that helps the poor and you would actually see what people do to help them.

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=Chico23231;928312]This is really becoming so silly, its insane to see how this country is so media driven. Its really amazing.

Its rare we get to hear what companies support outside the business world unless its a charitable organization, [B]I think lessen learned from Oreo's maker and Chickfila is to keep quiet.[/B] [B]I dont mind when people or corporation use their first admendant right, even if I dont agree, but I sick of the god damn media and talking heads on cable and radio driving their extreme, hate filled rhetoric home.[/B]These people dont want to talk about the legit issue, they just want to throw punches. We get suckered into it and Chickfila in the end gets paid.[/quote]


At first i thought CFA might lose Chick Fil A Bowl, but after the overwhelming support yesterday i dont see it happening. So I think from a business perspective all of this has been very good for Oreo and CFA.

Could not agree more about the media.

But i dont think this issue is going away anytime soon. Its probably gonna get worse. The Democratic Party just tenitvely voted to endorse same sex marriage:

[URL="http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390444405804577559362547995788.html"]Democrats Back Gay Marriage for Party Platform - WSJ.com[/URL]

This was before Chick Fil A Day so who knows if theyll backpeddel at all?

But I dont think federally supporting gay marriage does anything or could do anything in the next 20 or so years. Heck, the Civil Rights Act didnt even force states to allow interacial marriages. No chance we see an admendment for gay marraige anytime soon. Probably a decent chance at a Supreme Court ruling within 20 years, although im sure a ruling would be complicated.

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Meanwhile the Republicans have boxed themselves in a corner, not for being anti gay marriage, but by being so positive traditional marriage. The answer should have always been that they personally think marriage is between 1 man and 1 women; however, that they believe the government has no business being in our bedrooms or being part of something that is ultimately a commitment between 2 people and God.[/FONT][/COLOR]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]That gets the independent vote and retains nearly all of the base. Instead Republicans continue to preach small government while doing the opposite. [/FONT][/COLOR]

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

LMAO!

Watch this vid.
Vante exec makes video of himself harrasing a Chic Fil A employee.
His boss sees it and fires him.
What an idiot!

[url=http://www.businessinsider.com/vante-cfo-bullies-chick-fil-a-worker-then-promptly-gets-fired-for-it-2012-8]Vante CFO Bullies Chick-Fil-A Worker, Then Promptly Gets Fired For It - Business Insider[/url]

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=Alvin Walton;928335]LMAO!

Watch this vid.
Vante exec makes video of himself harrasing a Chic Fil A employee.
His boss sees it and fires him.
What an idiot!

[url=http://www.businessinsider.com/vante-cfo-bullies-chick-fil-a-worker-then-promptly-gets-fired-for-it-2012-8]Vante CFO Bullies Chick-Fil-A Worker, Then Promptly Gets Fired For It - Business Insider[/url][/quote]

jeez, people are just effing morons. thats right go take it out on a cashier, wow. this guy was in a leadership position. Sell all of your stock in Vante immediately

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

What an a-hole

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

The cashier handled that very well. Much more composed than I would have been

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=Mattyk;928159]I still don't understand why a company needs to have a stance on gay marriage.

Chicken with a side of homophobes, what a combo.[/quote]

As Target the same question.

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[quote=NC_Skins;928261]When you actively fund groups that lobby against the gay community, it's no longer "[I]just a view[/I]." At that point, I believe that they should deny these companies right the to do business in their area if they see fit.



I posted this on facebook the other day and the message applies greatly here.

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/KJQDa.jpg[/IMG]

Most of the religious conservatives don't want the government to interfere in their lives, but have no problem insisting it does so in other people's lives. Irony. Hypocritical. Asinine.[/quote]

I believe if you look closely enough, you'll find just as much hypocrisy on your end. Such as wanting all to recognize something they do not believe in as valid, which is how the Christian community would see legalized gay-marriage. So, you can't argue on both sides. If you truly want equality, you need to be arguing for the Marriage Law to end, not to be amended.

You can't expect everybody to see things the way you do, especially when you continue to spill hateful words and names their way. You'll never be taken seriously. Example, Fred Phelps. Nobody, including a large part of the Christian community, takes him and his group seriously. Until you recognize that you cannot force others, through your insults, to see and believe as you do, the issues will never be solved. That's a big part of a lot of these social issues. Both sides trying to force the other to see things the way they do, when everybody should have the right to their beliefs without ridicule.

The best thing to do is to end the marriage law completely. Nobody receives tax benefits, which of course would suck for married people, but ahh well...you'll adjust. Nobody is considered legally married, because marriage will be given back to the religious institution - where it was born from in the first place. The only caveat will be that everybody will be free to put whoever they wish on their insurance. It would no longer be a need for husbands and wives, since there would be no such thing, legally.

The legal system would be free of so many divorce cases, and those splitting up their "marriage" would not be forced to lose half of what they have earned over the years. Of course, you'd still need the legal system for custody of children, but divorce could be a lot less of a mess without the legal system in place (sorry for those here who are divorce lawyers.)

Finally, gays could come up with their own version of marriage if they so choose. Just like religious people would still continue to get married via a priest or pastor conducting the service. Religious people and others who are against homosexuality would no longer need to worry about ridicule from the PC "Lefties" who call them bigots for believing what the bible says. It would be none of your business. Just like gays being happily married would be none of the business of the religious right.

No harm no foul, one could go quietly observing his/her right-winged conservative ways, you could go on quietly hating religious people. :)

Re: North Carolina passes same-sex marriage ban
 

[IMG]http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/j/MSNBC/Components/Photo/_new/120803_chickfila_hmed_0745p.photoblog600.jpg[/IMG]

I never heard any hate from the owner of Chick'Fil-A. He just does not believe in gay marriage. If I'm correct I don't even think he said that and he said that he and CFA supported traditional mar. and families. Not sure how that considered hate. Some people think drinking is wrong and I drink but don't view their opinion as hate. Also heard some CFA have been vandalized.