Re: NFLPA Files Collusion Lawsuit Against NFL, Owners
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;918461]Another good article laying out the issues: [URL="http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/michael_mccann/05/23/nfl/index.html?sct=nfl_wr_a1"]NFL Players Association lawsuit against NFL could be decided by Judge Doty - Michael McCann - SI.com[/URL][/quote]

The first arguement for the NFL is one everyone is talking about the signed agreement not to persue collusion. but the second arguement....
[quote]
[LEFT][COLOR=#000000]Second, the mere absence of most teams "taking advantage" of an uncapped season does not prove collusion. Teams could have decided, on their own, to refrain from spending an unusually large amount of their owners' money in 2010. By definition, decisions by individual teams do not constitute collusion.
[/quote]

is BS. The arguement would be a good arguement had the Redsksins and Cowboys not been punished. Their arguement would stand pretty good. But why then punish two teams if the low spending was volentary? By punishing two teams for "violating the spirit of the CAP" in which there was no CAP proves in itself there was an agreement (spirit of a CAP).

What should have happened because there was no CAP in place is no punishment to anyone whether they spent below the floor or went over the CAP. When the new CBA and CAP was in place then all teams needed to be below the CAP. The Skins and Boys were. Thus no punishment.

There was a reason for a "uncapped" year. One could argue the NFL violated "the spirit of the uncapped" year. The purpose it was put into the CBA was to force the owners and players to get an agreement prior to it and if it didn't then they new spending $$$ could be fair game. The punishing of two teams for violating the "spirit of the CAP" when there was no cap proves their was some form of agreement between all the owners and they felt the need to punish two teams for their "competative advantage" the other owners failed to take advantage of.
[/COLOR][/LEFT]

Re: NFLPA Files Collusion Lawsuit Against NFL, Owners
 

and then there is this arguement..... why did it take 2 yrs to find collusion.
[QUOTE]
Also in regards to evidence, expect the NFL to wonder why it has taken the NFLPA two years to uncover supposed evidence of a widespread conspiracy among potentially hundreds of persons, many of whom are in regular contact with media.
[/QUOTE]

Anyone in their right mind could guess the owners were colluding even we fans knew something was up since teams were not going out buying up FA's like candy and spending $$$, but all that is just assumptions. There was no real substantial proof of any collusion until the NFL came out and said we are punishing the Redskins and Cowboys for their violating the spirit of the CAP. < What CAP? There was no CAP. There can be no violation if there was no CAP. So by punishing the two teams the NFL has admitted there was some form of agreement (spirit) and some form of CAP to which the two teams violated which in reality they didn't cause there was also a "SPIRIT OF THE UNCAPPED YEAR" which was technically violated by 28 teams. No, those 28 teams didn't have to spend a lot, but by punishing two teams that did is in violation of the "spirit of the uncapped" year.

So because of the punishment (in 2012) there is finally some form of proof there was collusion. The NFLPA didn't wait 2 yrs after they had proof they maybe waited 2 months to get their ducks in a row and file the right arguement as well as somewhat wait to see what info they could did up from the appeal.

Re: NFLPA Files Collusion Lawsuit Against NFL, Owners
 

If Doty allows the law suit to go on (which I doubt), then If I was the NFLPA although not working directly with the Redskins and Cowboys.... I'd be making them witness #1 and Witness #2. Take the stand please.

If this happens I can see the NFL trying to make the two teams heads a little foggy about details.

Re: NFLPA Files Collusion Lawsuit Against NFL, Owners
 

[quote=SBXVII;918454]?

[B]What other law suits are you talking about[/B]. The whole mess is getting annoying ...yes. I agree. But I think its funny. This is like understanding all the behind the scene's going ons with WWE. lol. One big soap opera.

But in reality there has only been one law suit. The NFLPA vs. NFL. Ours was just an appeal to the punishment, and it really wasn't the punishment but rather the process/proceedure that led to the punishment.[/quote]


All the concussion lawsuits, Vilma, this one....just so tired of it.

Re: NFLPA Files Collusion Lawsuit Against NFL, Owners
 

[quote=skinsfan69;918448]All these lawsuits are getting annoying.[/quote]


The Goodell Dictatorship with no regard to actual rules is getting annoying.


Don't blame those bringing these lawsuits (except the concussion claimants like Chip Lohmiller)...blame the man who is making these lawsuits absolutely necessary. I think Vilma may have a case. What was done to us and Dallas was completely absurd.

So sick of hearing about us "violating the spirit of the rule" that wasn't even in place at the time. This is like us getting pulled over for 35MPH and ticketed because they're planning on changing the sign to 25MPH next month, so they're getting a head start on catching the speeders.

Re: NFLPA Files Collusion Lawsuit Against NFL, Owners
 

[quote=SBXVII;918465]There was no real substantial proof of any collusion until the NFL came out and said we are punishing the Redskins and Cowboys for their [B]violating the spirit of the CAP[/B].[/quote]

The fact that there was no effort by the NFL to establish and enforce a salary [U]floor[/U] in the uncapped year was also a hint that this whole mess had nothing to do with the NFL's attempts to ensure competitiveness among the teams. As we all know in our hearts, for the NFL it was about keeping down spending on player contracts and forcing the NFLPA to yield. Proving that assertion is entirely another matter.

Re: NFLPA Files Collusion Lawsuit Against NFL, Owners
 

[quote=Monkeydad;918474]The Goodell Dictatorship with no regard to actual rules is getting annoying.


Don't blame those bringing these lawsuits (except the concussion claimants like Chip Lohmiller)...blame the man who is making these lawsuits absolutely necessary. I think Vilma may have a case. What was done to us and Dallas was completely absurd.

So sick of hearing about us "violating the spirit of the rule" that wasn't even in place at the time. This is like us getting pulled over for 35MPH and ticketed because they're planning on changing the sign to 25MPH next month, so they're getting a head start on catching the speeders.[/quote]

I agree. The commish is a first class two faced dick. The owners are greedy bastards for putting in a BS cap in an up capped year. Not all, but a lot of the former players are suing to get their pockets a little fatter cause they see all the money the NFL makes. All the BS crappy calls we see week after week cause of the trickle down concussion awareness. I love the NFL.... but lately, especially this past year, all of this crap is really starting to turn me off.

Re: NFLPA Files Collusion Lawsuit Against NFL, Owners
 

[quote=KI Skins Fan;918478]The fact that there was no effort by the NFL to establish and enforce a salary [U]floor[/U] in the uncapped year was also a hint that this whole mess had nothing to do with the NFL's attempts to ensure competitiveness among the teams. As we all know in our hearts, for the NFL it was about keeping down spending on player contracts and forcing the NFLPA to yield. Proving that assertion is entirely another matter.[/quote]

I feel it was more about John Mara attempting to gain a competitive edge over 2 divison rivals. We've already been over this, the Cowboys and us weren't the only two teams to take advantage of the uncapped year. We were the only two penalized for it though.

Re: NFLPA Files Collusion Lawsuit Against NFL, Owners
 

[quote=mooby;918491]I feel it was more about John Mara attempting to gain a competitive edge over 2 divison rivals. We've already been over this, the Cowboys and us weren't the only two teams to take advantage of the uncapped year. We were the only two penalized for it though.[/quote]

Mara just pissed because he thought we had painted ourselves into a financial corner via the cap. Bruce Allen took over and with the help of Mr. Eric Schaffer built an expensive bridge to get us out of that corner. I would be pissed too if i just found out i wasnt as smart as I always thought.

Re: NFLPA Files Collusion Lawsuit Against NFL, Owners
 

Good job Mr. Mara, way to f*** up the labor peace :doh:

Re: NFLPA Files Collusion Lawsuit Against NFL, Owners
 

^^ This.

Re: NFLPA Files Collusion Lawsuit Against NFL, Owners
 

The thing that pisses me off about all of this is the blatant cherry picking and what would seem to be targeting division rivals.

See obviously we all know the Redskins structured contracts so they could get out of them after the uncapped year. The Cowboys on their end signed Miles Austin to a new contract that was very front loaded. And maybe the NFL would have a case if that was the issue.

However we've all seen the chart that showed other teams structuring contracts to favorably reflect the uncapped year, most prominent example being the Bears giving Julius Peppers $35 million in the first year.

Of course you can't get a majority vote to punish something when almost half the teams did it in some way shape or form.

The Redskins and Cowboys were singled out for their spending not their structuring of contracts. It's absolutely pathetic. The power trip has to end.

Re: NFLPA Files Collusion Lawsuit Against NFL, Owners
 

[url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/09/19/team-by-team-salary-cap-numbers-if-there-were-a-salary-cap/]Team-by-team salary cap numbers, if there were a salary cap | ProFootballTalk[/url]
Surprise surprise the top cash spenders in 2010.

Redskins: $178.2 million.

Cowboys: $166.5 million.

Saints: $145.0 million.

The curve-ball is the Raiders at 8 but nevertheless it's still an abuse of power.

Anyway here's the best article I've read on the situation
[url=http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/michael_mccann/05/23/nfl/index.html]NFL Players Association lawsuit against NFL could be decided by Judge Doty - Michael McCann - SI.com[/url]

Re: NFLPA Files Collusion Lawsuit Against NFL, Owners
 

[quote=Dirtbag59;918572][url=http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/09/19/team-by-team-salary-cap-numbers-if-there-were-a-salary-cap/]Team-by-team salary cap numbers, if there were a salary cap | ProFootballTalk[/url]
Surprise surprise the top cash spenders in 2010.

Redskins: $178.2 million.

Cowboys: $166.5 million.

Saints: $145.0 million.

The curve-ball is the Raiders at 8 but nevertheless it's still an abuse of power.

Anyway here's the best article I've read on the situation
[url=http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/michael_mccann/05/23/nfl/index.html]NFL Players Association lawsuit against NFL could be decided by Judge Doty - Michael McCann - SI.com[/url][/quote]

According to that list, 16 of 32 teams were over the "secret cap" of $123m. Also, punishing #1, #2, #3, and #8 seems less than systematic.

Re: NFLPA Files Collusion Lawsuit Against NFL, Owners
 

[quote=SBXVII;918465]and then there is this arguement..... why did it take 2 yrs to find collusion.


Anyone in their right mind could guess the owners were colluding even we fans knew something was up since teams were not going out buying up FA's like candy and spending $$$, but all that is just assumptions. There was no real substantial proof of any collusion until the NFL came out and said we are punishing the Redskins and Cowboys for their violating the spirit of the CAP. < What CAP? There was no CAP. There can be no violation if there was no CAP. So by punishing the two teams the NFL has admitted there was some form of agreement (spirit) and some form of CAP to which the two teams violated which in reality they didn't cause there was also a "SPIRIT OF THE UNCAPPED YEAR" which was technically violated by 28 teams. No, those 28 teams didn't have to spend a lot, but by punishing two teams that did is in violation of the "spirit of the uncapped" year.

So because of the punishment (in 2012) there is finally some form of proof there was collusion. The NFLPA didn't wait 2 yrs after they had proof they maybe waited 2 months to get their ducks in a row and file the right arguement as well as somewhat wait to see what info they could did up from the appeal.[/quote]

The only problem with that is that the NFLPA's complaint says they signed the salary cap reallocation agreement on March 11, but claims they only learned of the collusion on March 12...and their "new" evidence of collusion is the press / blogger reaction to the announcement of the salary cap reallocation.

Yes, their complaint essentially says that the salary cap reallocation wasn't evidence of collusion, but that the press release announcing it and the press / blogger reaction to it was new evidence of collusion.

Read that again.