Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Schneed10;698238]This is a great point, ignorant is a good word.

Despite my finance background, I'm even ignorant of the best way to manage $100M. Difference is, I'm smart enough to know that I need to learn more about it before I go giving any money to people.[/quote]

One would hope so but you keep forgeting the fact that some (not all)did the right thing,they went to professionals ,they sought advice,they diversified their holdings and still lost it and you call them dumb.Just read the paper and look at how Goldman-Sachs is behaving and you want to go to Wall St. and smack them all in the mouth.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=53Fan;698229]You're a Giants fan Giantone. You'll always be dumb to us. ;)[/quote]

LOL....right back atya!:food-smil

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Giantone;698359]One would hope so but you keep forgeting the fact that some (not all)did the right thing,they went to professionals ,they sought advice,they diversified their holdings and still lost it and you call them dumb.[B]Just read the paper and look at how Goldman-Sachs is behaving and you want to go to Wall St. and smack them all in the mouth[/B].[/quote]

Ain't that the truth!

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Giantone;698357]Find the post I said 100% of my money,read again I said if you invested $1000 and I did 1 million according to you if we invest in the same thing and it goes under I'm stupid but your not,I might have lost more money bit you are just as dumb as everyone else.[/quote]

K well sticking with the gist of your point, the scale is all relative. If I put $1000 of my money in "something" (as you call it), but I've got $49,000 in other things, then losing the $1000 isn't a big deal. Likewise, if you have $1 million in that losing investment, it's a big deal if you only had say $1.5 million to your name. If you had $50 million to your name, not a big deal.

But that's the thing, this article says these guys have lost nearly all of their money.

What I'm contending is such a bad move, is taking all of one's money, and turning it over to one financial adviser, or one investment. That makes no sense, and it sure seems like everybody should just know that.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Giantone;698359]One would hope so but you keep forgeting the fact that some (not all)did the right thing,they went to professionals ,they sought advice,they diversified their holdings and still lost it and you call them dumb.Just read the paper and look at how Goldman-Sachs is behaving and you want to go to Wall St. and smack them all in the mouth.[/quote]

How could somebody lose all their money by diversifying their holdings? That's just not possible.

Even in the stock market crash that just occurred, the market went down 40-50%. So dudes would have lost half their money, not all of it.

The only way they could have lost it all through investing was to put too many eggs in one basket, or otherwise take unnecessary risks with their money. Such as investing in a business venture, handing your money over to a Madoff type, etc. Which comes back to giving too much money to the wrong people.

I get it. Some of these athletes were victims of predatory attempts to suck money out of them under the premise that returns would be great. But once you're rich, why even bother investing aggressively from there? Why do multimillionaires need to hit it big on other business opportunities?

Greed. And greed is foolish.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Schneed10;698387]How could somebody lose all their money by diversifying their holdings? That's just not possible.

.[/quote]


To think that can't happen now that's ignorant.

You're just like a Monday morning QB easy to throw stones after it's done.Sallie Ma,Fannie Ma,AIG,Merril,GM,Toyota.....how many banks have failed,real estate dropping like a rock,and again I bring up Goldman Sachs and Bernie Madoff(plus many more),you take all that and then add in the collateral fallout from those companies going down or under?

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Schneed10;698387]

I get it. Some of these athletes were victims of predatory attempts to suck money out of them under the premise that returns would be great. But once you're rich, why even bother investing aggressively from there? Why do multimillionaires need to hit it big on other business opportunities?

Greed. And greed is foolish.[/quote]

Ahh, no you don't becuase if you did you wouldn't ask a question (questions) like that.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Giantone;698638][B]To think that can't happen now that's ignorant.[/B]

You're just like a Monday morning QB easy to throw stones after it's done.Sallie Ma,Fannie Ma,AIG,Merril,GM,Toyota.....how many banks have failed,real estate dropping like a rock,and again I bring up Goldman Sachs and Bernie Madoff(plus many more),you take all that and then add in the collateral fallout from those companies going down or under?[/quote]

Calling me ignorant on financial markets couldn't be further from the truth. I hold a graduate degree in finance and work in the field. It's you who's talking on a subject matter you don't understand.

All those companies you named, none of them had stock go to 0. So even if they were heavy into just ONE of those companies, they still wouldn't have lost ALL of their money.

Like I said, it was typical for guys to lose 40%, 50% in the market, even if investing wisely. But the only way you can lose all your money in the market is if you invested foolishly.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Giantone;698639]Ahh, no you don't becuase if you did you wouldn't ask a question (questions) like that.[/quote]

Then enlighten me. If you're already a mutlimillionaire, why would you need to take risks on finding the next big business boom?

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

Years ago when I worked with the Panthers I got to know Donnie Shell and one of his primary jobs was to work with rookies and players who had just received big contracts. When Shell played obviously the money was not what it is today so many of those guys had other jobs, thus they learned to manage money.
Also, the minute someone figures out you can go pro everything is "handled" so it is easy to lose perspective on the real world. Although it is easy for kids who are not going to pro to blow money or run up massive credit card debt. Maybe more time should be spent on this in Freshmen 101 than the worthless crap they make you do.

We had a player who did not understand why he could not rent a car. Well the guy forgot to pay a couple of speeding tickets, even though we had literally put the address and stamp on the envelope so he could mail it in.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Schneed10;698641]Calling me ignorant on financial markets couldn't be further from the truth. I hold a graduate degree in finance and work in the field. It's you who's talking on a subject matter you don't understand.
[/quote]

Nice. Haha.. I love these little board squabbles & drama.. Giantone, looks like Schneed called your bluff and had a pair of Aces.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

why are Giants fans chiming in on a Skins board! go back to New Jersey!

JETS are better than the Giants now...it has to kill them.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Schneed10;698641]Calling me ignorant on financial markets couldn't be further from the truth. I hold a graduate degree in finance and work in the field. It's you who's talking on a subject matter you don't understand.

All those companies you named, none of them had stock go to 0. So even if they were heavy into just ONE of those companies, they still wouldn't have lost ALL of their money.

Like I said, it was typical for guys to lose 40%, 50% in the market, even if investing wisely. But the only way you can lose all your money in the market is if you invested foolishly.[/quote]

LOL....You take alot of things for granted.No one said they were heavey into one or another ...and yes you are ignorant of finance...if I were your parents I'd ask for my money back.You asked how could someone lose all their money by deversifying and I showed you it's possible.Now you try to change the discussion when proven wrong.You are the problem.....serously if you really have a finance degree and I came to you for advice then just like some of those athletes(not all)I would be in the crap house becuase you don't seem to know anything.You keep trying to mix the athletes that did what they were suppose to with the ones who didn't.
POINT>>>>>>>>>>If I have millions and I take my money to a finacial advisor(with a degree ...you know like yours) and he invests it and I did what he says,shouldn't he know to deversify? You always seem to go right by the Goldman Sachs stuff and the Berni Madoff stuff and make things up,again the fact that you are to ignorant of the facts to understand how these thing happen even more if you really have a degree is scary.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=ethat001;698689]Nice. Haha.. I love these little board squabbles & drama.. Giantone, looks like Schneed called your bluff and had a pair of Aces.[/quote]

...............but I have a full house.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=tootergray34;698694]why are Giants fans chiming in on a Skins board! go back to New Jersey!

JETS are better than the Giants now...it has to kill them.[/quote]

....wow.........

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Giantone;698695]LOL....You take alot of things for granted.No one said they were heavey into one or another ...and yes you are ignorant of finance...if I were your parents I'd ask for my money back.You asked how could someone lose all their money by deversifying and I showed you it's possible.Now you try to change the discussion when proven wrong.You are the problem.....serously if you really have a finance degree and I came to you for advice then just like some of those athletes(not all)I would be in the crap house becuase you don't seem to know anything.You keep trying to mix the athletes that did what they were suppose to with the ones who didn't.
POINT>>>>>>>>>>If I have millions and I take my money to a finacial advisor(with a degree ...you know like yours) and he invests it and I did what he says,shouldn't he know to deversify? You always seem to go right by the Goldman Sachs stuff and the Berni Madoff stuff and make things up,again the fact that you are to ignorant of the facts to understand how these thing happen even more if you really have a degree is scary.[/quote]

Man, this is like debating a brick wall. Or a two year old. Neither of which has any purpose. But I'm a stubborn son of a bitch, so I'll perpetuate anyway.

1) I've addressed the Madoff type stuff all throughout this thread. I've said repeatedly, you should never give all your money to just one person, even if they have a degree and a great track record. That's unwise, and something everyone should know. A lot of really smart people got duped by Madoff, but if they had their money spread around with a few different advisors, they would have only lost the portion invested with Madoff. You don't just diversify your holdings, you need to diversify your advisors too.

2) You haven't proven anything with regards to how you can lose all of your money in the market, while at the same time being invested in an intelligent fashion. If someone had all of their money in Enron, then it went under, that's a crying shame and a crime on Enron's part no doubt. But it was stupid to have all your money in one stock. That's been my contention all along; if investors are properly diversified (across sectors, asset classes, international markets, and with various advisors) then there's no way you can lose all your money. It's just not possible. Case in point:

- During 2008 (the onset of the Great Recession), the US Stock Market lost ~50%.

- On black Monday in 1987, the Dow and S&P lost 20-25%.

- During those two periods (some of the worst stock market crashes in history), asset classes like bonds and commodities increased in price.

So if the investor was appropriately diversified, he would have lost less than half his money. Furthermore, if he didn't sell when it hit bottom, within 3-5 years he'd have all the lost money back. I'm just giving you the facts (but I guess that degree was worthless).

3) You don't know what you're talking about when it comes to the troubled companies you listed. While Toyota and Goldman have faced trouble, none have lost too much value when it comes to the stock price. You're going to have to explain to me how someone can lose all their money being invested in one of these companies:

- [B]Toyota[/B]: Two years ago was trading right around $100 per share. At the low point following the recalls, it traded at $60 (a 40% loss). Now it trades at $80. Were they troubled? Yes. Did investors lose all their money? Hardly.

[url=http://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=TM+Interactive#symbol=TM;range=2y]Toyota Motor Corporation Common Share Price Chart | TM - Yahoo! Finance[/url]

- [B]Goldman Sachs[/B]: Before it was crushed by the mortgage backed securities it held, Goldman was trading around $150 per share. It dipped to a little more than $50 as those bad investments nearly froze the rest of its business. A big drop for sure, 66% to be exact. Following the US bank bailout, the company has since recovered and now trades at $150 again, even given the recent bad news. Were they troubled? Yes. Did investors lose all their money? Not at all, in fact, those that held on for the ride have just as much money as they did two years ago.

[url=http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=GS&t=2y&l=on&z=m&q=l&c]GS: Basic Chart for Goldman Sachs Group, Inc. (The) - Yahoo! Finance[/url]=

- AIG, Merril, and Fannie & Freddie all suffered precipitous falls they haven't yet recovered from. In those cases investors lost 90% and still haven't recovered. But if you're ever entirely invested in one company, you're a fool. Just like Enron, investors were crushed. But if you own a little of AIG, a little of Google, a little of Johnson & Johnson, a little gold, a little bonds, and a little international stock like you're supposed to, you wouldn't have been hit too hard.

But I must not know what I'm talking about. Take your knowledge and go back to New Jersey. This is a Redskins discussion board for the knowledgeable fan. You are neither.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Schneed10;698730]Man, this is like debating a brick wall.

But I must not know what I'm talking about. Take your knowledge and go back to New Jersey. This is a Redskins discussion board for the knowledgeable fan. You are neither.[/quote]

No you don't ,I can Yahoo and google everything you just did.What is really funny is you can't even follow the discussion on the board.Not one of my post did I say a thing about investing in Goldman Sachs ....I said and was refering to investing "WITH"....Goldman and how they lost money for their investors while making it for them selves rocky.
What is ignorant is that you as a so called investment advisor ...refuse to understand or acknowledge that this can happen.This thread is about people... athletes some inteligent others not so much.Yet these people went to people.....just like yourself and were told all the same things you are spouting off about and I'm sure they to were told that their advisors were smart with degrees...and guess what we are here talking about how they lost all there money,and again if you go back and read the artical not all lost every penny but did go bankrupt.

Last of all I want to address the fact that this is not a football issue shouldn't matter who I root for in this discussion and I have always respected the Redskin fans on this site.I do admit that their are people on this board more knowelegable then I when it comes to the Skins I have never said anything else ever but on this issue I do know more then you becuase I admit that it can happen where you on the other hand can't admit it can.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Giantone;699028]No you don't ,I can Yahoo and google everything you just did.What is really funny is you can't even follow the discussion on the board.Not one of my post did I say a thing about investing in Goldman Sachs ....I said and was refering to investing "WITH"....Goldman and how they lost money for their investors while making it for them selves rocky.
What is ignorant is that you as a so called investment advisor ...refuse to understand or acknowledge that this can happen.This thread is about people... athletes some inteligent others not so much.Yet these people went to people.....just like yourself and were told all the same things you are spouting off about and I'm sure they to were told that their advisors were smart with degrees...and guess what we are here talking about how they lost all there money,and again if you go back and read the artical not all lost every penny but did go bankrupt.

Last of all I want to address the fact that this is not a football issue shouldn't matter who I root for in this discussion and I have always respected the Redskin fans on this site.I do admit that their are people on this board more knowelegable then I when it comes to the Skins I have never said anything else ever but on this issue I do know more then you becuase I admit that it can happen where you on the other hand can't admit it can.[/quote]

Sigh... morons. No read so good.

1) I am not a financial advisor. I have a graduate degree in finance, and work in the field. But not as an advisor.

2) You gloss over my points again and again. Handing 100% your money over to one advisor, whether Madoff, or someone at Goldman, or Merril, or any single advisor from any reputable company, is foolish. If an athlete handed 100% of his money to one of those guys, and he lost it all, he should be ashamed of himself.

3) If you went bankrupt, that means you lost everything.

You're too dense to debate with any longer.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Schneed10;699040]Sigh... morons. No read so good.

1) I am not a financial advisor. I have a graduate degree in finance, and work in the field. But not as an advisor.

2) You gloss over my points again and again. Handing 100% your money over to one advisor, whether Madoff, or someone at Goldman, or Merril, or any single advisor from any reputable company, is foolish. If an athlete handed 100% of his money to one of those guys, and he lost it all, he should be ashamed of himself.

3) If you went bankrupt, that means you lost everything.

You're too dense to debate with any longer.[/quote]

1) good...you stink at it,again your parents should get their money back.

2)Never said 100% of anything your reading comprehension is very lacking and your lack of facts to back up your statements is astounding.

3) No it doesn't but hey you never lets facts stand in the way of a good story.
4) name calling....very nice ,class act.

5) ...and if this was a real debate ,you would be gone,you were toast in your first post.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

Ah yes, the debate tactics of a simpleton. Offer nothing of value or substance to the discussion, instead split hairs in a point-counter-point effort to save face and distract from the fact that you know nothing of what you speak.

I've already challenged you here, the fact that you've not yet responded only confirms how little you know. Answer me or be gone:

[url]http://www.thewarpath.net/redskins-locker-room/36462-why-do-so-many-nfl-players-9.html#post698642[/url]

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Giantone;698695]LOL....You take alot of things for granted.No one said they were heavey into one or another ...and yes you are ignorant of finance...if I were your parents I'd ask for my money back.You asked how could someone lose all their money by deversifying and I showed you it's possible.Now you try to change the discussion when proven wrong.You are the problem.....serously if you really have a finance degree and I came to you for advice then just like some of those athletes(not all)I would be in the crap house becuase you don't seem to know anything.You keep trying to mix the athletes that did what they were suppose to with the ones who didn't.
POINT>>>>>>>>>>If I have millions and I take my money to a finacial advisor(with a degree ...you know like yours) and he invests it and I did what he says,shouldn't he know to deversify? You always seem to go right by the Goldman Sachs stuff and the Berni Madoff stuff and make things up,again the fact that you are to ignorant of the facts to understand how these thing happen even more if you really have a degree is scary.[/quote]
It is painful to read your posts. If it isn't for the firstdownisms, errant punctuality or lack of breaking up paragraphs, it's that you refuse to space after ending a sentence (or statement since your writings don't always meet the requirement).

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=tryfuhl;699151]It is painful to read your posts. If it isn't for the firstdownisms, errant punctuality or lack of breaking up paragraphs, it's that you refuse to space after ending a sentence (or statement since your writings don't always meet the requirement).[/quote]

That's why I love fanning the flames here. With every jumbled piece of garbage of a post, he looks more and more like a moron.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Dirtbag359;697925]It never ceases to amaze me how poorly these guys mismanage their money:
[url=http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Why-do-so-many-NFL-players-go-bankrupt-?urn=nfl,190555]Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt? - Shutdown Corner - NFL Blog - Yahoo! Sports[/url]

[url=http://www.mediatakeout.com/2009/21738-study_60_of_nba_players_are_broke_after_5_years_of_retirement.html]Study: 60% Of NBA Players ARE BROKE After 5 Years Of Retirement - MediaTakeOut.com™ 2010[/url]

[url=http://www.businesspundit.com/25-rich-athletes-who-went-broke/]25 Rich Athletes Who Went Broke | Business Pundit[/url][/quote]

Hey man, i'm gonna be in town can i crash at your place for a couple days?
(Meaning 2-3 weeks while i eat your food, drive your car etc...)

Hey, its cousin Paulie can i borrow around 2,000 bucks?

Dad: Your uncle Steve can't get to work cuz he crashed his car and his insiurance isn't covering it could you help out?

Agent/Fixer: I need 50,000 so the girl you banged in City X will fianlly stop calling you (black mailing you)

Sister: Can you help me out with a downpayment? (On a house we can't afford where you'll later have to take over the payments?)

Girlfriend: Just get me a charge card already! (A Black Card)

Friend/Cousin/Sister/Stranger: I've got a great business deal for you.....

Then there the houses, cars, parties, jets, call girls, strippers, hotels etc.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=30gut;699171]...

Girlfriend: Just get me a charge card already! (A Black Card)

...[/quote]

whys it gotta be a [U]black[/U] card huh


j/k :D

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

What you sippin on? Its no problem
Black and gold bottles like I'm from New Orleans
but shawty I'm far from a Saint
but I got two AMEXs that look the same way

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Schneed10;699155]That's why I love fanning the flames here. With every jumbled piece of garbage of a post, he looks more and more like a moron.[/quote]

LOL...and yes the name calling again,you lost admit it and move on.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Giantone;699180]LOL...and yes the name calling again,you lost admit it and move on.[/quote]

I repeat:

I've already challenged you here, the fact that you've not yet responded only confirms how little you know. Answer me or be gone:

[URL="http://www.thewarpath.net/redskins-locker-room/36462-why-do-so-many-nfl-players-9.html#post698642"]http://www.thewarpath.net/redskins-l...tml#post698642 (Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?)[/URL]

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Giantone;699180]LOL...and yes the name calling again,you lost admit it and move on.[/quote]

Well to be fair, Schneed calling someone a moron really isn't name calling, it's just a standard Philly greeting.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;699209]Well to be fair, Schneed calling someone a moron really isn't name calling, it's just a standard Philly greeting.[/quote]

Hell, add in the "Schneed Factor" and that is practically like giving you a brofriend hug.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=tryfuhl;699151]It is painful to read your posts. If it isn't for the [B]firstdownisms[/B], errant punctuality or lack of breaking up paragraphs, it's that you refuse to space after ending a sentence (or statement since your writings don't always meet the requirement).[/quote]

Are you insulting him by using me as an example. Thanks.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=firstdown;699252]Are you insulting him by using me as an example. Thanks.[/quote]
nothin but love brotha

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Giantone;699180]LOL...and yes the name calling again,you lost admit it and move on.[/quote]

Schneed calling someone a moron is just his way of recognizing someone exists. :D

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=53Fan;699310]Schneed calling someone a moron is just his way of recognizing someone exists. :D[/quote]


LOL.........see that I can live with.:goodjob:

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Giantone;699483]LOL.........see that I can live with.:goodjob:[/quote]

That's what I thought, no response. You're dismissed.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;699212]Hell, add in the "Schneed Factor" and that is practically like giving you a brofriend hug.[/quote]



LOL....Ok,ok I'll ease up on the little guy since he lost all his ice cream money in the market Thursday.

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

[quote=Giantone;699506]LOL....Ok,ok I'll ease up on the little guy since he lost all his ice cream money in the market Thursday.[/quote]

Any time you want to prove me wrong, go right ahead...

I've already challenged you here, the fact that you've not yet responded only confirms how little you know. Answer me or be gone:

[URL="http://www.thewarpath.net/redskins-locker-room/36462-why-do-so-many-nfl-players-9.html#post698642"]http://www.thewarpath.net/redskins-l...tml#post698642 (Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?) (Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?)[/URL]

Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?
 

Locked due to jackassery