The Obama Years- A GOP love story

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tshile
07-18-2014, 10:37 AM
The President did NOT have a televised address to the country.
Which I already agreed with you on...

The President did NOT have FAA technicians on the ground in the Ukraine this morning, waiting to gain entry to the crash site.

Fox News is reporting that there are investigators that will be deployed. How many, from which agencies, and when they'll be at the crash site is not public information, but we are sending people....


The President did NOT meet with bipartisan members of congress while at the fund raiser.
Right... the fund raiser again... but you have no idea if he did or didn't before or after the fund raiser.... That's my point... you're using the fund raiser to take jabs and insinuate something you, I, and everyone else has zero clue about.

I wouldn't put it past this president to shirk off his responsibilities in this situation, don't get me wrong. I've yet to see this president display anything close to traits of strong leadership.

I just can't help but chuckle at how this stuff goes every time there is an issue... it doesn't seem to matter who the president is, everyone's aware of everything going on behind the scenes and becomes a critic all the sudden...


The President did NOT in his initial public statement (or subsequent ones that I am aware of) condemn military force against commercial airlines and call publicly for all sides to acknowledge that safe passage of civilian airlines is an unmoveable fact.

Yes some things happen in the backdrop, but THIS incident should have been, imo, handle openly and forcefully within moments of assessing that it was a military rocket hitting a civilian airline, and the world knows it was not.

The President's public statement was yesterday somewhere around 1 or 2 PM. I do not recall there being significant evidence (publicly) available at the time that said it was indeed a missile, but maybe I wasn't paying enough attention.

As we speak the White House has announced that the President is preparing to address the nation...

It seems like on some of these points you're being critical just for the sake of being critical. Like I said... for many of the things you suggest as 'better' ways of dealing with this, you have no way of knowing it's not already being done. For others... you haven't allowed very much time, or for very much fact searching, to write off those actions as not being taken yet.

tshile
07-18-2014, 10:40 AM
Im/We are outraged over the airliner, why are we not? The shooting of the plane is a rally point, you honor the victims by ending all this foolishness...I dont get fake outrage, 9/11 was feign outrage to invade Afganistan and stop the Taliban? Why cant we seek justice, do the investigation and stop the war in the Ukraine? See what i mean is this generation cant hold focus, its instant gratification and then move on. Internet shaming wont work on Russia.

Right... because everything I've talked about has to do with instant gratification and internet shaming.

When you're ready to stop taking jabs at me for asking simple and basic questions (that you've still yet to answer) let me know. I'll continue the conversation.

Chico23231
07-18-2014, 10:44 AM
Right... because everything I've talked about has to do with instant gratification and internet shaming.

When you're ready to stop taking jabs at me for asking simple and basic questions (that you've still yet to answer) let me know. I'll continue the conversation.

Post 197 and 203 is in response to you question.

tshile
07-18-2014, 11:31 AM
Fair enough :)

I agree whole heatedly with your post 197.

But as I said, I take some issues with your other post. Which is not at all intended to suggest that's a bad way to handle it, or the wrong way. Just that I see how it's not a 100% good way of doing it, and wonder whether there is a better way.

Off the top of my head - maybe consider that the downing of this airliner was an accident and that there would be some good to be done by approaching Russia sincerely. The good being done would be cooperation on all sides to investigate and bring people accountable. Maybe that would open the door to a resolution of the entire Ukraine/Russia issue? Probably not, but possibly?

That may be entirely naive, and I recognize that. I just can't help but wonder :)

CRedskinsRule
07-18-2014, 11:36 AM
President Obama is about to give a statement on it. Whether it will be Hallmark condolences and fluff, or substantive and confirmable actions will let us further this discussion, I would think.

Edit:
I would give the President a decent mark. I think he addressed several points. I don't think it went far enough, but I can also accept that he wasn't going to.

Chico23231
07-18-2014, 01:23 PM
Interesting tidbit of the plane crash...did anyone hear how the President first heard about the incident? Him and Putin were on the phone together yesterday morning about the sanctions and Putin mentioned it to Obama as the convo was ending. Just amazing.

Also amazing is the rumor the plane black boxes are already in Russia. why is that?

Chico23231
07-18-2014, 01:33 PM
BBC News - MH17 crash: Ukraine releases alleged intercepts (http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-28362872)

Pretty damning evidence.

Cossacks are an ethic group basically bred for military combat. They pretty much come out the womb ready to fight. Kinda badasses

tshile
07-18-2014, 01:38 PM
The evidence is piling up as to who did it... the only important remaining question to me is whether or not it was an accident.

If they misidentified a plane in a war zone and took action, then we should be looking to bring charges to those responsible and whatever punishment the international courts can do.

If it was intentional then it's going to be hard to separate Russia from the people that pushed the trigger... things could get quite messy...

CRedskinsRule
07-22-2014, 10:03 AM
Sometimes headlines are misleading, but in this case it's a direct quote from the Prime Minister of Turkey, and a bit crazy for a President who came in to make the US more "likeable" in the world

I no longer talk to Obama: Turkey's Erdogan (http://news.yahoo.com/no-longer-talk-obama-turkeys-erdogan-100909241.html)

tshile
07-22-2014, 10:18 AM
Sometimes headlines are misleading, but in this case it's a direct quote from the Prime Minister of Turkey, and a bit crazy for a President who came in to make the US more "likeable" in the world

I no longer talk to Obama: Turkey's Erdogan (http://news.yahoo.com/no-longer-talk-obama-turkeys-erdogan-100909241.html)

When you look at the information that's come from 'insiders' recently, including books, it's not all the surprising.

This president seems to be... absent when it comes to foreign policy issues.

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