Is it finally time to rebuild??

Graham Gano essentially represents the conundrum Redskins fans face. Ask every 5 Redskins fans, and probably 3 want him gone. But if you want to rebuild, you probably have to have patience and put up with Gano missing some kicks, Sundberg botching a snap, Banks fumbling, Riley committing a penalty, Moore missing a tackle...that said, there's a fine (very fine) line between being patient and holding on for too long

The concept of rebuild has been well adopted in the minds of many fans, but will it be adopted at the box office. If this team continues it's losing ways, attendance will suffer greatly, forcing management to somehow find a happy medium. Yesterdays announced attendance 66,000+ could become the norm.

Mike Wise - Mike Shanahan and Washington Redskins must face need to rebuild (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/12/05/AR2010120504268.html)

I'm sure the weather was a factor in that

We have NOT tried to rebuild yet. A lot of people equate losing to rebuilding. Just because we suck doesn’t mean we’re rebuilding. We’re still giving up draft picks for 34 year old players. That is not rebuilding – that’s saying we want to win now. If you want to pick up some veteran FA’s. Fine. If you are trading for them, sacrificing young future players for the team, you’re still trying to win.
I’m ready to break the core of this team apart. See what we can get some value for, turn to the younger players. Start building a new attitude in DC. Not saying trade away everyone. But keep age in mind. Anyone over the age of 27/28 should be expendable, for the right price.

I've kind of wondered about attendance before. If we keep having all these losing seasons, i guess at some point we really could be like Detroit, and have the stands at less than capacity.

How bad do things have to get around here for us to experience a "blackout" from TV, like other poor franchises have??

The capitals didn't really have a profound "rebuilding." They just drafted well with their first and second round picks, and after four or five years of having high picks yielding quality players, they started to turn the franchise around.


IMO they had the definitive hockey rebuilding year, they sent Gonchar and a host of other veteran players off for anything they could get in draft picks, IMO it doesn't get a lot more "rebuilding" then what the Caps did when they recognized how badly the team needed it. I admit it's pretty subjective

IMO the Skins should have been in rebuilding mode every year for the last decade. When you piss away 19 total draft picks on 5 players who lasted any time and were productive players via trade/draft trade ups then you "reap what you sow"

I am refering to:
2nd and Bailey for Portis (instead of just Bailey)
3rd for Brunell
1st, 3rd, & 4th total picks for Campbell
3rd & 4th total picks cost of Cooley
3rd & 4th for TJ Duckett
3rd & 4th for Brandon Lloyd
2nd & 6th + another drafts 2nd cost for Rocky McIntosh
2nd & 6th for Taylor
3rd or 4th rounder for Brown pending McNabb
2nd & 3rd or 4th rounder for McNabb

That's a total of 19 picks sent for (arguably) 5 long term starting Redskins of any caliber and two of those (McNabb and Brown obviously) are assuming McNabb and Brown stay for years to come and that is VERY much in question, as Brown is a unrestricted free agent in 3 games and McNabb... well who knows...

The Skins team building philosophy (if you can credit it with enough forethought to call it a philosophy) has been to sacrifice the long term (young potentially talented draftees who might play for 6 or 10 years) for proven players who may have a few years left on the clock, but usually spend at least one of those years adjusting to new systems and then often the next year adjusting to a new HC or coordinator and their systems.

McNabb's first year here is a great example... So was Brunell's

The Redskins are rebuilding. As it's been pointed out, 1/3 of the roster was turned over, and with limited resources, Shanahan and Allen did the best they could to put a team on the field this year. Combine that with injuries and transitions on both sides of the football, and you have a team that looks like what the Skins are right now.

The foreseeable future (2011, 2012), you'll see more of the roster overturned, and Shanahan will have the opportunity to fill in the gaps with guys he thinks can run the system. After last week's thumping and yesterday's sloppy loss, these guys are playing for their careers the rest of the season. They'll have to prove to Shanny that they can fit the system and continue to improve.

Sure, we've been saying this for years, and Shanahan decided not to rebuild last year. I still wonder whether that was the right choice. BUT - now our starting #1 WR is 32 with few options behind him, our best LB and key to the defense is Fletcher (36) and here's an abbreviated list of one of the oldest rosters on the planet (ages for 2011):

P.Daniels - will be 38
McNabb - will be 35
Fletcher - will be 36
Casay Rabach - will be 34
Artis Hicks - will be 32
Santana Moss - will be 32
Andre Carter - will be 32
Kemo - will be 32
D. Dockery - will be 31
Clinton Portis - will be 30
Roydell Williams - will be 30

Cooley - will be 29
J.Brown - will be 29

I won't mention Galloway is all but already retired.

The question is - can we fix this team in 2-3 years? If not, we should rebuild, dump older players and accept a couple of bad seasons as they get experience. The Capitals rebuilt and now has one of the best young rosters in the league for years to come. The Eagles and Tampa Bay also come to mind with young talent.

The second question is: since coaches are rewarded for success - is there no incentive for Shanahan to rebuild because he knows that he could get fired if he does not deliver success within 2 years?

I listened to the radio today and they mentioned that a writer supposedly heard or is writing about how Shanahan might be gone and Gruden in. lol. Shanahan signed a 5 yr deal. At the end of last yr everyone screamed to DS to get rid of VC, Higher a decent GM and HC, let them coach and build a team, and continuity. Everyone said we can't keep changing our system every 2 yrs. I'd like to think Shanahan will get his 5 yrs as long as he keeps showing improvement each year. Now if the team gets worse or still has a losing record then I can see DS letting Shanahan go, but not until after he has a few yrs to try and fix 10 yrs of distruction.

Now you mentioned needing to replace 5 people on the defensive side of the ball. Clearly Kemo is not the answer, or so I believe. Carter is not a 3-4 type of LB. Fletcher did pretty well and if they pick up another decent LB to replace Carter the LB might show better. If the team can build up the DL to younger, healthier, faster players who can take on more then one guy then the LB's might be able to get a better pass rush.

Depending on whats available in FA might depend on what they have to do in the draft. I'd like to see the team either go OL or DL in the first two picks, but since we have many needs it might also be wise to back out of our mid 1st round pick for more picks. Rabach has to go. I'd take either Center or RT. I feel if we can get the 3 main staples of the OL shored up the two Guard positions don't have to be top ranked talent. We also need a NT unless one of our Rookie guys steps up. and the QB spot? I get the feeling McNabb is here to stay and thats ok with me as long as they do something with the OL to give McNabb more time to throw and make holes for our RBs. Otherwise I see the need to get someone with legs to be able to run from when he has to.

I'd be happy going into next year with Torain, Williams, and Davis, but I'd still pick up a RB maybe a UFA who's decent. WR is the biggest need after OL on offense. Maybe Vince Jackson will be available, TJ Houshmendzadeh, and after them I'm not sure who is available. Those two alone along with Armstrong might be formidable. Thats not even talking about Austin yet and maybe another UFA WR.

How I'd fix this:

WR- FA.
OL- Draft.
DL- Draft.
LB- Draft/FA.
FS- Draft.
QB- Not sure. I think the teams plan is to keep McNabb. Grossman is not the answer. Can Beck be the guy? if not they need to start thinking of someone to fill in when McNabb goes down.

I'm sure the weather was a factor in that

That's true, it was definitely cold wet and a little windy, and believe me by the end of the game there was nowhere close to 66,000 left in the stands. I'm not so sure there was that many at the start of the game. Only the true die-hards were present yesterday.

Every crappy team is about 3 small moves away from at least being respectable. OFFENSIVE LINE!!! That's it. That's the only thing that matters. This is not hard to figure out, I don't understand why we can't EVER have a decent offensive line anymore. We are the only team that has a nickname for our O line glory days for Christ Sake. A massive, pissed off group of hairy armed Offensive linemen should be industry standard in DC. Like good Defense in Pittsburgh or Chicago or sissy's in Dallas. You want better defensive play, get an offensive line. You want better QB play, get an offensive line. You want aging WR's to be more effective, get an offensive line. You want to save money, get an offensive line, sign my slow ass for 50 grand a year at running back and watch me get 125 a game behind those corn fed mules. 3 studs and 5 above average guys. That's it. That's how you win a SB with Trent Dilfer at QB. That's how you take a 6th round pick named Tom Brady and turn him into TOM BRADY!!! A young confident QB is a dangerous thing, talented or not. O line gives that to you. I would use every single draft pick for 3 years on O line. I'd be lining up a 350 pound monster running a 6.6 40 yard dash at wide receiver I'd be so deep at O line. We might not win a SB, but we'll go 10-6 and make the playoffs every single year from now until the end of time. That's how I still have faith in our deflated franchise. Always 3 moves away if they can figure it out.

http://www.thewarpath.net/redskins-locker-room/40422-time-to-play-gm-3.html#post768237

These threads do seem very similar, don't they? I'd merge them but I'm refusing to participate in mod activities except for in nickel packages