The Official Defense Has Major Issues/Fire Jim Haslett Thread

Well, since Green Bay's defense has given up 75 points in their last three games, I can only assume we all have the Bears tonight?

i do...Cutler looking pretty damn fine

I actually have the Bears too. Sorry for crapping all over the point I was trying to make, which is that defensive points against doesn't say much about a defense without looking at victory margins.

Bears were impressive on the road at Dallas last week. Especially the way they held on late. Green Bay consistency the last couple years reminds me alot of Dallas...great one week, god aweful the next.

That was a direct apples to apples comparison: 2009 Detroit and 2010 St. Louis.

Do you want to break out the numbers from last year's first Giants game? No, I really don't think you do, especially if you're of the position that our defense is worse now.

The point is, factually speaking, our defense was horrible through three weeks last year. They ended up in the middle of the pack after all was said and done. They were a strong unit in most of October. This is simply being overlooked right now as people come with the pitchforks and torches to the new DC is that, apples to apples, the old defense struggled just as much in our 1-2 start last year.

Worst case scenario right now is that: nothing is different and we'll only go as far as the offense can take us. Because that's just the kind of team we've been the last three seasons.

You're simply taking stats from the years worst game to support you argument. The defense played well in the first Giants game. Anyone with football knowledge knows that the defense, although flawed, was decent. Not a great create havoc type of defense but good enough to make the playoffs if the offense could score more points. So why come in and totally change the scheme when the players you have don't fit? To me that's shitty coaching. You didn't see Mike Tomlin come in and run the Tampa two when he got the Pittsburgh job.

You're simply taking stats from the years worst game to support you argument. The defense played well in the first Giants game. Anyone with football knowledge knows that the defense, although flawed, was decent. Not a great create havoc type of defense but good enough to make the playoffs if the offense could score more points. So why come in and totally change the scheme when the players you have don't fit? To me that's shitty coaching. You didn't see Mike Tomlin come in and run the Tampa two when he got the Pittsburgh job.You're completely missing the point, and you're doing it without evidence, which is worse.

The point is that I/we simply don't know how good the defense is going to be this year. It might be top ten. It might be bottom ten. It's probably going to be somewhere in between. We need to see more before passing judgment on the virtues of the 3-4. All people are doing in this thread is passing judgment prematurely.

Last year's defense was worse through three games, and all we did last year was write them a pass because of the offense -- which was more productive in both losses last year than it was in both losses this year.

It's not hard to see that closed mindedness re: the 3-4 is causing people to point out that this year's defense had sucked when the EXACT same people were defending just a poor coaching/playing effort last year because we had a 4-3.

I'm not saying that Haslett is necessarily going to make the adjustments that make this defense passable, I'm just saying that if your issue here was that the defense is talent-loaded and underachieving...where the hell was everyone the last two years what that was PRECISELY the case in our 4-3.

You're completely missing the point, and you're doing it without evidence, which is worse.

The point is that I/we simply don't know how good the defense is going to be this year. It might be top ten. It might be bottom ten. It's probably going to be somewhere in between. We need to see more before passing judgment on the virtues of the 3-4. All people are doing in this thread is passing judgment prematurely.

Last year's defense was worse through three games, and all we did last year was write them a pass because of the offense -- which was more productive in both losses last year than it was in both losses this year.

It's not hard to see that closed mindedness re: the 3-4 is causing people to point out that this year's defense had sucked when the EXACT same people were defending just a poor coaching/playing effort last year because we had a 4-3.

I'm not saying that Haslett is necessarily going to make the adjustments that make this defense passable, I'm just saying that if your issue here was that the defense is talent-loaded and underachieving...where the hell was everyone the last two years what that was PRECISELY the case in our 4-3.

I'm not sure how you're quantifying "worse" but I'd be interested in knowing. Of course we don't know how good the defense is going to be this year and I don't think people here are really trying to make that point. Adjustments and scheme changes are fine and expected, but no was expecting the defense to fall off the cliff to 32nd in the league, GTripp.

We don't need sixteen games to see that this ain't working and Haslett appears to be in over his head big time. It's not just a personnel issue, it's a coaching issue from what I can see. Can I prove that it's a coaching issue with stats? Hell no. Seventeen of the thirty two teams run a 3-4 scheme, yet we're making it look like algebra.

You're completely missing the point, and you're doing it without evidence, which is worse.

The point is that I/we simply don't know how good the defense is going to be this year. It might be top ten. It might be bottom ten. It's probably going to be somewhere in between. We need to see more before passing judgment on the virtues of the 3-4. All people are doing in this thread is passing judgment prematurely.

Last year's defense was worse through three games, and all we did last year was write them a pass because of the offense -- which was more productive in both losses last year than it was in both losses this year.

It's not hard to see that closed mindedness re: the 3-4 is causing people to point out that this year's defense had sucked when the EXACT same people were defending just a poor coaching/playing effort last year because we had a 4-3.

I'm not saying that Haslett is necessarily going to make the adjustments that make this defense passable, I'm just saying that if your issue here was that the defense is talent-loaded and underachieving...where the hell was everyone the last two years what that was PRECISELY the case in our 4-3.

So you think Andre Carter is a 3-4 outside backer? Nope. Yet he's one of our best pass rushers. Where has he been? Is Haynesworth a nose tackle? Nope. Is Rocky an inside backer? No. Where is Chris Wilson? Do we even have a true nose tackle? No. Are Hall and Rogers zone corners? No. So yes it's very early but there are just too many indications that this is going to be a crappy defense cause guys seem to be out of position.

So you think Andre Carter is a 3-4 outside backer? Nope. Yet he's one of our best pass rushers. Where has he been? Is Haynesworth a nose tackle? Nope. Is Rocky an inside backer? No. Where is Chris Wilson? Do we even have a true nose tackle? No. Are Hall and Rogers zone corners? No. So yes it's very early but there are just too many indications that this is going to be a crappy defense cause guys seem to be out of position.


I agreed with everything you said except this. Corners have to be able to play zone and man period. That is what a corner does. Either you can play corner or you can't. Hall and Rogers can play corner. The scheme needs to be adjusted because they are getting beat and it isn't their fault most of the time.

Green Bay got off to a rough start last year while transitioning to the 3-4 and ended up alright by the end of the year. Gotta give things time.

I agreed with everything you said except this. Corners have to be able to play zone and man period. That is what a corner does. Either you can play corner or you can't. Hall and Rogers can play corner. The scheme needs to be adjusted because they are getting beat and it isn't their fault most of the time.

They're both playing like shit. Who were those scrubs that were beating them yesterday?? What about letting Walter go off last week? I think they need to let them play more bump and run and let them be athletes.