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GTripp0012 01-31-2009, 04:40 PM Lineman don't get traditional stats kept for them, but here's a cursory look at Grimm's very nice career vs. McDaniels via PFR. It's clear that McDaniels case was much stronger.
McDaniel (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/McDaRa00.htm)
Grimm (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/G/GrimRu00.htm)
Grimm probably needs to do something of note with his coaching career to get elected. I'd call him 'borderline', and it's great that he's come as far as he has in the process, but he's going to keep getting passed over unless he does something as a NFL head coach, unfortunately.
GTripp0012 01-31-2009, 04:45 PM I don't think you can really argue with any of the inductees. Also surprised Shannon Sharpe didn't get in.
Disagree with Hayes, Gtripp. He changed the way the game was played, and he also has more receiving TDs than Art Monk (who also had a longer career), 20 yard AVERAGE per catch, and 0 fumbles. He was important for the game, stats don't tell the whole story -- but he arguably has the stats to be HoF worthy.Well, I can see the argument for him statistically, but I don't see how/when he did anything to change the way the game was played. He had a explosive beginning to his career, then teams adjusted, and he was never really great after that again.
According to the PFR Blog (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/blog/?p=1341) there are 12 HOF eligible receivers with a stronger case than Hayes. I'd say when a player is in the top five at his position in terms of HOF eligible (but not in yet) talent, he "deserves" to get in. Hayes, even including his wonderful 3 PR TDs, really seems like he jumped a bunch of more qualified people to get in.
vallin21 01-31-2009, 04:45 PM I agree with Gtripp, you're telling me Sharpe, Carter or Reed couldn't beat out Bob Hayes? Any one of those guys are equally deserving (if not more) to have their busts in Canton. Too bad for Carter, correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't Jerry Rice come on the ballot next year? If so its going to be a few years before Carter will get in
GTripp0012 01-31-2009, 04:54 PM I agree with Gtripp, you're telling me Sharpe, Carter or Reed couldn't beat out Bob Hayes? Any one of those guys are equally deserving (if not more) to have their busts in Canton. Too bad for Carter, correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't Jerry Rice come on the ballot next year? If so its going to be a few years before Carter will get inI don't know for sure if Rice gets on the ballot next year, but I would suspect he does.
Emmitt is definately on the ballot next year. Rice had that training camp run with the Broncos back in 2005, so I'm not sure if that forces him back another year.
But if it doesn't that's two spots that absolutely are taken by sure-fire hall of famers, and Carter could get pushed back another year.
44ever 01-31-2009, 05:35 PM Lineman don't get traditional stats kept for them, but here's a cursory look at Grimm's very nice career vs. McDaniels via PFR. It's clear that McDaniels case was much stronger.
McDaniel (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/McDaRa00.htm)
Grimm (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/G/GrimRu00.htm)
Grimm probably needs to do something of note with his coaching career to get elected. I'd call him 'borderline', and it's great that he's come as far as he has in the process, but he's going to keep getting passed over unless he does something as a NFL head coach, unfortunately.
What about his contribution to AZ if they win the SB. I'm sure that will help. With a SB as a assistant HC and Line coach might that be enough?
GTripp0012 01-31-2009, 05:40 PM What about his contribution to AZ if they win the SB. I'm sure that will help. With a SB as a assistant HC and Line coach might that be enough?I really doubt that the voters will treat his work as an assistant coach in his hall case, but I guess you never know what they are thinking.
44ever 01-31-2009, 06:11 PM you know what Gtripp it's only a matter of time for him anyway. He will be a HC someday and a winner I'm sure :)
dmek25 01-31-2009, 06:27 PM Canton's calling: Bruce Smith, Woodson into Hall (http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/9157152/Bruce-Smith,-Woodson-highlight-new-Hall-class)
skinsfan_nn 01-31-2009, 06:49 PM I think most predicted Bruce to be a shoe in first shot. Even though Bruce being a local boy I can't consider him anything but a bill that never won the big one with that team. He was a used up when the skins picked him up (I remember a very cheap/freebie sack...and a phone call on the side line, those are 'HIS' skin highlights). But good for him.
But really hate to see Russ bypassed again. Keep hoping his day/year will come! Hope it starts with another Superbowl ring tomorrow.
skinsfan69 01-31-2009, 06:50 PM I agree with Gtripp, you're telling me Sharpe, Carter or Reed couldn't beat out Bob Hayes? Any one of those guys are equally deserving (if not more) to have their busts in Canton. Too bad for Carter, correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't Jerry Rice come on the ballot next year? If so its going to be a few years before Carter will get in
What you're forgetting is the game back then was nothing like it is today. Carter and Sharpe no question have the stats and both were great players. But Hayes played in an era where the forward pass isn't nearly what it is today and no question he changed the way NFL defenses played coverage because of his raw speed. Also 71 TD's from 64-74 is quite impressive. I don't have a problem with this selection.
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