McNabb, Warner, and the Hall of Fame

Warner should make it to the HOF on his story alone.

His rags to riches NFL story couldn't be better. I don't see why he wouldn't since he has a super bowl ring in tow.


McNabb has to win if he wants in.

I say yes to both. Yes to Warner because of his SB appearances

Yes to McNabb because he has only had a No. 1 reciever once in his career and has still managed to put up the numbers that he has. Outside of Westbrook, he has never had another weapon on the offense. That is HOF worthy if you ask me.

This does not change nor dilute my hatred towards McNabb, I just gotta give credit where credit is due.

mcnabb is not marino.

mcnabb is not marino.

Niether is Warner but they are all HOF quality QB's. Warner was amazing and now is unbelievable. McNabb didn't play on the Rams. But did an amazing job with the Eagles. Like him or not, definatly HOF

mcnabb is not marino.

Not many guys are comparable to Marino. I don't understand your point.

good thread. if you would tell someone that McNabb has better career stats then Warner, they wouldn't believe you. i say yes to both. McNabb has done more with less talent then probably anyone in the game. and Warner, minus the Giant season, has been nothing short of amazing his whole career

I think both will definitely get in. I'll go out on a limb and say Warner will be a first ballot. But McNabb will get in eventually.

Both players have bounced back from adversity serveral times only to have career seasons and hoist their teams into the playoffs. Just six weeks ago, we thought McNabb was done and look how he's not only turned himself around but now the entire team seems to be playing at a high level.

Another thing about McNabb, he has consistently gotten it done with very average talent at wideout. Warner on the other hand, has played with future Hall of Famers. This current crop of wideouts included.

I a big Warner fan and I think he's borderline. I just don't think he's got the longevity that it takes to get in. But if Arizizona somehow wins the SB then I think he'll get in. I wish we would've signed him after the 04 season.

McNabb is borderline too. But I think he's gotta win a SB to get in.

Mike Greenberg called McNabb a hall-of-famer on Mike and Mike this morning, which is probably the stupidest thing said about football this year. And that would include some of the things said around here about Zorn/Campbell.

His basis for doing this is that:

1) Donovan McNabb will have better numbers than Troy Aikman when he retires.
2) Donovan McNabb will have better numbers than Steve Young when he retires.
3) Both Troy Aikman and Steve Young are Hall-of-Famers.

He also says that Brett Favre, Peyton Manning, and Tom Brady are the sure-fire Hall-of-Famers from this era. Does McNabb belong in the same category with these guys?

There is no doubt that players in the current era will have the strongest passing statistics of players in any era ever. So the direct comparison to Young/Aikman is already imperfect.

I'll get to Aikman/McNabb in a minute. Here's Young vs. McNabb in career rate totals.

Completion Percentage
Steve Young 64.3
Donovan McNabb 58.9

Yards per Attempt
Steve Young 8.0
Donovan McNabb 6.8

TD Rate
Steve Young 5.6%
Donovan McNabb 4.5%

Sack Rate
Steve Young 7.94%
Donovan McNabb 6.96%

INT Rate
Steve Young 2.6%
Donovman McNabb 2.1%

Passer Rating
Steve Young 96.8
Donovan McNabb 85.9

I included stats where McNabb was better to show how close it was in comparison to Young, and without coming up with a complicated era regression multiplier to normalize the numbers. On all stats that don't pertain directly to negative plays, McNabb is clearly inferior to Young, and it really isn't even all that close. I don't have any idea how Greenberg is claiming that McNabb has better numbers than Young. Even ignoring the elephant in the room -- the fact that McNabb played in a big passing era on a big passing team -- he's still not even remotely comparable to Steve Young on merit.

But since "compares well to Steve Young" is not necessarily a hall of fame criteria, let's look at Greenberg's other comparison: Troy Aikman.

McNabb actually compares much better to Aikman.

Completion Percentage
Troy Aikman 61.5
Donovan McNabb 58.9

Yards per Attempt
Troy Aikman 7.0
Donovan McNabb 6.8

TD Rate
Troy Aikman 3.5%
Donovan McNabb 4.5%

Sack Rate
Troy Aikman 5.21%*
Donovan McNabb 6.96%

*Well above average for the time, but again, Aikman's protection was particularly outstanding, perhaps the best in history. McNabb's had very good protection by current standards, but nothing like Aikman.

INT Rate
Troy Aikman 3.0%
Donovman McNabb 2.1%

Passer Rating
Troy Aikman 81.6
Donovan McNabb 85.9

Aikman, statistically, is a much better McNabb comparable. Although era-adjusted Aikman would put McNabb to shame, Aikman's best years are concentrated in the six best years in the history of the Cowboys franchise: 1991-1996. In those seasons, he never posted a completion percentage below 63.7. Outside of those seasons, he never got above 59.5. That's unheard of, and probably had everything to do with the talent around him. Aikman's 61.5% career figure is one he not ever came within two points in any single season. Astounding.

But here's the point: A random player with Troy Aikman's numbers is NOT a hall-of-famer. That's the big point here. Troy Aikman is in Canton because and because he won three Super Bowls, not because he was a particularly great passer. Donovan McNabb is also not a particularly great passer, and happens to have no Super Bowls. If he can win his next two games, he will have a single Super Bowl. And he still won't have anywhere near Aikman's credentials for hall-of-fame selection.

Although, if you want to use the innovator angle on McNabb, he is widely credited with bringing the bounce pass to football. That's got to be worth something, right?

Look, Donovan McNabb is a good player. But if he goes in the Hall-of-Fame for any reason but sympathy, then what do you tell Jeff Garcia?

Or Mark Brunell?

Or Rich Gannon?

Or Chad Pennington?

Or Steve McNair?

Or Trent Green

Or Marc Bulger

Or Matt Hasselbeck?

Most, if not all, of those guys will never make the hall of fame. But if Donovan McNabb deserves it, don't all those guys deserve at least the same honor, if not a greater one?

Warner, it's not a sure thing, but he would definately get my vote.

Though their are a lot of reasons to keep him out, I believe he's one of the elite quarterbacks of the era. He's on a whole level above McNabb.