Five Things I'm Sure About (sort of)

the one thing that is starting to bother me Flacco, Ryan, and Pennington. all three of those guys stepped into NEW systems and had successful years. the new system argument seems to be the main sticky point on why Campbell hasn't stepped up to the next level of qbacking. it really carries little, to no weight

dmek25. I see your point and everyone else that looks at it this way. But, what nobody seems to be asking is: if it's a new system and Flacco, Ryan and Pennington are succesful it must also mean there teams as a whole are sucsessful.

I think it's fair to say our team as a whole is not succesful in the new system. JC didn't give up the points, the Defense did. Had Moss not dropped so many, if our O line gave better pass protection. If we had a better pass rush. If Smoot was still Smoot. ect...

Had we beat the Rams and Bengals we'd be in the playoffs. Our TEAM needs to step up. Including JC.

dmek25. I see your point and everyone else that looks at it this way. But, what nobody seems to be asking is: if it's a new system and Flacco, Ryan and Pennington are succesful it must also mean there teams as a whole are sucsessful.

I think it's fair to say our team as a whole is not succesful in the new system. JC didn't give up the points, the Defense did. Had Moss not dropped so many, if our O line gave better pass protection. If we had a better pass rush. If Smoot was still Smoot. ect...

Had we beat the Rams and Bengals we'd be in the playoffs. Our TEAM needs to step up. Including JC.

If everyone else does their job, Jasons job becomes easier. If the line does their job, he gets time. If the receivers are where they're suppose to be, he can release the ball sooner knowing they're gonna be there. It can't be easy learning a new offense while you're running for your life and trying to hit receivers who either drop the ball or are not where they're suppose to be. That's not making excuses, that's just the way it is. Now having said that, Jason has made mistakes too. Missed throws etc. He's made improvements this year whether people want to see it or not, but he still looks inaccurate and hesitant at times. Could be him, could be other factors. Probably a little of both. But I'm really interested myself in seeing JC run an offense where the rest of the players are doing their job as well as they should be before we send him packing. I suspect he's getting too much blame for a poor performance by the offense as a whole.

the one thing that is starting to bother me Flacco, Ryan, and Pennington. all three of those guys stepped into NEW systems and had successful years. the new system argument seems to be the main sticky point on why Campbell hasn't stepped up to the next level of qbacking. it really carries little, to no weight

Two points (well maybe three). Every analyst has clearly stated Flacco works in the simplest system possible and nothing like a WC. Baltimore runs behind a much superior o-line to ours and then Flacco gets to throw downfield here and there to the open receiver. Extreme simplicity is the theme. Pennington is tried and trued vet and while some may disagree I've always thought he was a very smart QB... so he did well in a new system that has some excellent weapons. No surprise. And for Matt Ryan... carried by a healthy RB and o-line all year. Did you watch yesterday's game? W/o Turner burning it up Ryan looked like just another rookie - held the ball forever (as JC has the tendency in our brand new system), struggled w/ accuracy, and IMO he rushed several throws.

And for Matt Ryan... carried by a healthy RB and o-line all year. Did you watch yesterday's game? W/o Turner burning it up Ryan looked like just another rookie - held the ball forever .

Excellent observation! Let's hope the JC haters seen that

Two points (well maybe three). Every analyst has clearly stated Flacco works in the simplest system possible and nothing like a WC. Baltimore runs behind a much superior o-line to ours and then Flacco gets to throw downfield here and there to the open receiver. Extreme simplicity is the theme. Pennington is tried and trued vet and while some may disagree I've always thought he was a very smart QB... so he did well in a new system that has some excellent weapons. No surprise. And for Matt Ryan... carried by a healthy RB and o-line all year. Did you watch yesterday's game? W/o Turner burning it up Ryan looked like just another rookie - held the ball forever (as JC has the tendency in our brand new system), struggled w/ accuracy, and IMO he rushed several throws.

Good points. I'll add a couple -

Flacco throws a much better and more accurate deep ball than Campbell, so when he does get a shot to throw downfield, he doesn't sqaunder it (how bad did Campbell overthrow ARE against the 49ers... would have been a TD). Campbell needs to put more air under the ball. Flacco also seems to have much better pocket-awareness. He steps up in the pocket, while Campbell gets balls tipped, because he doesn't.

Pennington - He's always been accurate, but he's taken his knocks much like Campbell. I think the main difference is coaching. Case in point, the Fins marched down the field on their first drive today without completing a single pass to a wide receiver. Zorn should have gotten the RBs more involved in the passing game and played Betts and Cartwright more often. Look what the Chargers did yesterday throwing to their RBs and Tight Ends. DOH! - Pennington just threw his third INT.

Ryan - yes, the O line and running game helped, but he demonstrated to me that he will be a better QB than Campbell. He's a rookie, while Campbell is in his 4th season. Ryan helped the pass protection by making quick decisions and getting the ball out quickly. He also put up good numbers with the same receivers Vick almost had run out of town (remember Peerless Price and all the talk of TO going to ATL, because White and Jenkins weren't that good?).

All that said, I think Campbell might have done just as well on all 3 teams. But he played for a team that needed him to do more and he either couldn't or didn't. He should have gone down swinging against the 49ers (with nothing on the line), but he turned in 156 yards.

We should know for sure next year.

dmek25. I see your point and everyone else that looks at it this way. But, what nobody seems to be asking is: if it's a new system and Flacco, Ryan and Pennington are succesful it must also mean there teams as a whole are sucsessful.

I think it's fair to say our team as a whole is not succesful in the new system. JC didn't give up the points, the Defense did. Had Moss not dropped so many, if our O line gave better pass protection. If we had a better pass rush. If Smoot was still Smoot. ect...

Had we beat the Rams and Bengals we'd be in the playoffs. Our TEAM needs to step up. Including JC.

Randle El seemed to drop a bunch as well. They can't go another year with him as the #2. Get the rooks ready!

Excellent observation! Let's hope the JC haters seen that

Let's not forget that Ryan's a rookie. I think most fans would have been euphoric about Campbell's season if he was just a rookie. And if Ryan plateaus or regresses in the next few years, Falcons fans will skewer him just Campbell gets skewered here on a regular basis;)

the one thing that is starting to bother me Flacco, Ryan, and Pennington. all three of those guys stepped into NEW systems and had successful years.


The Falcons and Ravens both changed their offenses. The Dolphins also run a new system but, their offensive coordinator Dan Henning was Chad Penningtons OC/QB coach with the Jets during his rookie year so the offense was new to the team not to the QB.*

Smith, Harbaugh and Sparano are rookie HC but each has a *veteran
offensive coordinator/playcaller and a QB coach.* This IMO allows them time to focus attention on the big picture of being a HC. Zorn has a 1st time OC who is new to the offense that Zorn is bringing in, Zorn doesn't have a QB coach but leans on 1st time offensive assistant Chris Meidt from Div. III St.Olaf.

Also all 3 teams are *strong on the offensive line despite injuries,
all 3 teams commit to running the ball, and protecting their respective QBs.*

Comparing apples and oranges.
Look i like Matt Ryan but put Campbell on the Falcons and IMO you would get similiar if not better production then Ryan.

Did you stop to compare their situations?

Matt Ryan has a veteran OC and playcaller in Mike Mularkey. Mularkey runs a vertical play-action heavy passing attack, as opposed to JC who is in the 1st year of the WCO which takes at 3 years to master JC has a 1st time playcaller Zorn and a 1st time OC Sherman Smith (who is new to the WCO himself.)

Matt Ryan has been only been sacked 17 times he's the 8th least sacked QB in the NFL. Campbell has been sacked 38 times tied for 4th most.

Falcons have the #2 ranked rushing offense in the NFL which drives their play-action heavy passing attack. Redskins have the 8th ranked rushing offense but the WCO doesn't feature alot of play-action.

Having Mike Mularkey on staff is IMHO the number one reason for Ryan's success.

Mike Mularkey comes to the Falcons with a vast amount of coaching and playing experience in the NFL, which includes two years as a Head Coach (Buffalo Bills) and two stints as an Offensive Coordinator — one with the Pittsburgh Steelers (2001–2003), and the other with the Miami Dolphins (2006). He also forged a successfull playing career that spanned nine years in the League as a tight end for the Minnesota Vikings (1983–1988) and Pittsburgh Steelers (1989–1991).

Atlanta Falcons | People | Mike Mularkey (http://www.atlantafalcons.com/People/Coaches/Mike_Mularkey.aspx)

*Also they have a fulltime QB coach in Bill Musgrave. Zorn is JC's QB coach which is great, but Zorn is also the HC and therefore can't give JC fulltime attention therefore Zorn relies on 1st time NFL assistant Chris Meidt (Div. II HC) to help out with QB coach duties.

the new system argument seems to be the main sticky point on why Campbell hasn't stepped up to the next level of qbacking. it really carries little, to no weight


ESPN - Hasselbeck thriving in West Coast offense - NFL (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs05/columns/story?columnist=clayton_john&id=2311953)
^^^John Clayton article
SEATTLE -- Mike Holmgren professes that it takes three years to make a quarterback in the West Coast offense, and it takes five years for a West Coast quarterback to become a very good one.

"I thought Jason would eventually play well under Jim Zorn," ESPN Monday Night Football analyst Ron Jaworski says. "I didn't think he'd play this well, this early.

Let's put some perspective on this:

Matt Hasselbeck's first 3 seasons working with Zorn and Holmgren in Seattle:

2001: 176/321 54.8%, 2,023 yards, 7 TD, 8 INT, 70.9 rating
2002: 267/419 63.7%, 3,075 yards, 15 TD, 10 INT, 87.8 rating
2003: 313/513 61.0%, 3,841 yards, 26 TD, 15 INT, 88.8 rating

And here's what JC did in year 1 with Zorn:

2008: 315/506 62.3%, 3,245 yards, 13 TD, 6 INT, 84.3 rating

I think it's only fair we see how JC does in year 2 before any hard conclusions are made as to whether he can be a quality long term answer here or not. JC is already on par with what Hasselbeck did in year 2.

Sorry, but Jason Campbell is not a starting WCO quarterback and he never will be. The dude's 28 and we're still making excuses for him. Hes too scared to throw anything other than a check down or crossing pattern. The guy has no balls, its as simple as that.

We need to sign Garcia to groom Brennan if we plan on sticking with the WCO another year. JC will fail in the WCO in 2009 and that will only hurt his trade value. We should move him now for whatever we can get. Jason Campbell is not the future here. The sooner we move on, the better.Following your logic, we never should have fired Al Saunders. I believe that Campbell has the requisite skills to succeed in any system if we would pick one, stick to it, and allow him to develop. Campbell was MUCH better in his first year starting in a WCO than Hasselbeck was in Seattle, and we can all agree that Hasselbeck developed into a pretty good WCO QB. Note that it wasn't until his 3rd year running Seattle's WCO that Hasselbeck started playing at a Pro Bowl level.

Following your logic, we never should have fired Al Saunders. I believe that Campbell has the requisite skills to succeed in any system if we would pick one, stick to it, and allow him to develop. Campbell was MUCH better in his first year starting in a WCO than Hasselbeck was in Seattle, and we can all agree that Hasselbeck developed into a pretty good WCO QB. Note that it wasn't until his 3rd year running Seattle's WCO that Hasselbeck started playing at a Pro Bowl level.

Man would'nt that be great. I just heard Jeff Fisher say how important continuity and stability is to an organization. I'd be pretty happy to just have the same offense for 3 years in a row. I'm sure JC would too.