JLC: The Cerrato Era Has Begun

GTripp, sometimes you say some things that are really smart. And other times you make about as much sense as kidwell.

Coaches are largely responsible. I kind of get what you're saying, you can only gameplan to the talent you have. But if you don't gameplan and let your talent try to win on autopilot, you get your ass handed to you. There's a compounding effect that takes place when superior talent, superior teaching, and superior gameplanning collide.

You make it sound as if the coach is irrelevant.Well the assumption is that you have to gameplan, have to adjust, have to have common football sense.

So why is coaching overrated? Because every coach does these things. Fassel does them, Gibbs did them, Mooch does them, Norv does them.

When people say coaching matters, they are in effect talking about the long-term effects of having a coach that always knows more than the opponents coach. Unfortunately, with the easy access of coaching information today, any guy can learn how to coach on gameday. Seriously, it's not hard.

Now, the great coaches will be responsible for leadership techniques, and earning and keeping the respect of his players. If he can not do this, he will lose his job. This is what seperates Jeff Fisher from Cam Cameron. But that is not why the Titans made the playoffs this year and the Dolphins won one game. That was because Tennesssee had the most talented defense in the NFL, and the Dolphins had the least.

The short version: coaching matters. Unless you care nothing about the team than it's gameday performance. Because Coach A does not give a significant advantage to his team over Coach B.

You can't take Mooch out of SF, put him in Detroit and expect to see the team improve without any other major changes. That's pretty much been proven by trial and error over the past decade.

The concerns in JLC's blog entry about the stark differences between west coast QBs and Air Coryell/Gibbs/Saunders QBs are most alarming.

West Coast QBs are known for the quick release and quick feet. Campbell's got a long release. The changing of the guard on offense definitely brings Campbell's future into question. It's way too soon to say Campbell's no longer the franchise QB, but you have to wonder. Will he mesh with the quick-release West Coast offense? Zorn's a great coach, so he's got to have a decent shot at it, but you never know.

I'm also curious to see how guys like Bugel mesh with a west coast offense. These coaches, who are being kept for continuity's sake, have strong beliefs in their offensive philosophies. It remains to be seen how that meshes with the new West Coast approach headed by Zorn. It could be fine as Bugel and company show an ability to adapt, or it could be a complete disaster. Either way, Vinny has to be judged on all of it.

I totally agree. As soon as I heard about Zorn's west coast O roots, I knew it would be tough for JC, but especially after reading that it's disturbing. How many systems can he learn before he gets really frustrated?

What was more depressing to me was that GW wanted to keep Al on board.

I can't think of too many teams who have taken a QB coming from a non-West Coast system and tried to morph him to a West Coast QB. Can you think of any?

I mean Tampa chose Garcia. Holmgren grabbed Hasselbeck from Green Bay. Andy Reid developed McNabb from scratch. I can't think of a West Coast team choosing a non West Coast QB. I think there's got to be a reason for that, they're very different systems emphasizing very different skill sets.

Campbell may just translate well to it with the right coaching. But I think you're way off in saying the system won't be an issue.

Right off the top of my head I can't think of any. But, and I realize it was college, but there must be a reason Campbell did best playing in a WCO. And I don't believe it's simply because he had Ronnie Brown and Cadillac Williams. And if that is the case, well we have Portis and Betts

I can't think of too many teams who have taken a QB coming from a non-West Coast system and tried to morph him to a West Coast QB. Can you think of any?

I mean Tampa chose Garcia. Holmgren grabbed Hasselbeck from Green Bay. Andy Reid developed McNabb from scratch. I can't think of a West Coast team choosing a non West Coast QB. I think there's got to be a reason for that, they're very different systems emphasizing very different skill sets.

Campbell may just translate well to it with the right coaching. But I think you're way off in saying the system won't be an issue.System is an issue. Just not one we can ever evaluate due to the impossibility to seperate it from the players themselves.

Off the top of my head:

Rich Gannon (1999)
Brian Griese (2004)
Brad Johnson (2001)
Marc Bulger (2006)
Chad Pennington (2006)
Delhomme, maybe?

The big issue with the WCO is that it usually combines itself with another offensive philosophy. You don't really see an offense that ever does what wikipedia would define as the WCO (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_coast_offense). Therefore, we can't predict right now if there will be any player struggles, since we don't yet know what if anything is changing.

Well the assumption is that you have to gameplan, have to adjust, have to have common football sense.

So why is coaching overrated? Because every coach does these things. Fassel does them, Gibbs did them, Mooch does them, Norv does them.

When people say coaching matters, they are in effect talking about the long-term effects of having a coach that always knows more than the opponents coach. Unfortunately, with the easy access of coaching information today, any guy can learn how to coach on gameday. Seriously, it's not hard.

Now, the great coaches will be responsible for leadership techniques, and earning and keeping the respect of his players. If he can not do this, he will lose his job. This is what seperates Jeff Fisher from Cam Cameron. But that is not why the Titans made the playoffs this year and the Dolphins won one game. That was because Tennesssee had the most talented defense in the NFL, and the Dolphins had the least.

The short version: coaching matters. Unless you care nothing about the team than it's gameday performance. Because Coach A does not give a significant advantage to his team over Coach B.

You can't take Mooch out of SF, put him in Detroit and expect to see the team improve without any other major changes. That's pretty much been proven by trial and error over the past decade.

I get what you're driving at and to an extent I agree, but I still think you're minimizing the differences in teaching abilities and adaptability between coaches. Some coaches make better strategic adjustments than others do. But whatever. This thread's about Vinny, and certainly we can agree that now Vinny is in position to get judged on everything that happens from this point forward, including the decision to pair Zorn with the existing coaching staff and the existing player personnel.

Biggest issue: just because someone says they are a WCO disciple, doesn't mean you know one single thing about their offensive philosophy.

As Schneed pointed out, this thread is about Vinny. If you want to discuss different coaching philosophies and/or the importance of coaching, please express your beliefs in a different thread.

Well the assumption is that you have to gameplan, have to adjust, have to have common football sense.

So why is coaching overrated? Because every coach does these things. Fassel does them, Gibbs did them, Mooch does them, Norv does them.

When people say coaching matters, they are in effect talking about the long-term effects of having a coach that always knows more than the opponents coach. Unfortunately, with the easy access of coaching information today, any guy can learn how to coach on gameday. Seriously, it's not hard.

Now, the great coaches will be responsible for leadership techniques, and earning and keeping the respect of his players. If he can not do this, he will lose his job. This is what seperates Jeff Fisher from Cam Cameron. But that is not why the Titans made the playoffs this year and the Dolphins won one game. That was because Tennesssee had the most talented defense in the NFL, and the Dolphins had the least.

The short version: coaching matters. Unless you care nothing about the team than it's gameday performance. Because Coach A does not give a significant advantage to his team over Coach B.

You can't take Mooch out of SF, put him in Detroit and expect to see the team improve without any other major changes. That's pretty much been proven by trial and error over the past decade.

Seems way oversimplified to me. Of course, talent on the field makes a huge difference, but we only need to look back at the last half of the ole ball coach's season here to see how a stubborn coach's game plan works in the nfl if he refuses to adjust.

Are you in essence saying that game planning is overated, but motivation of players isn't? You stated early in this post that all coaches game plan. If You follow your logic, you are essentially saying that actually all coaches MUST have good game plans just to keep up w/the competition.

I still think you're minimizing the differences in teaching abilities and adaptability between coaches. Some coaches make better strategic adjustments than others do.This is actually an interesting debate I've evaluated both sides over, and am very confident in my position, is whether or not one coach can make strategic adjustments better than another, and if he can, does it really change the outcome of the game.

We could debate back and forth, but I'm sure it will come up in a thread that isn't about Vinny Cerrato, and I'll bring up some interesting points then.

As Schneed pointed out, this thread is about Vinny. If you want to discuss different coaching philosophies and/or the importance of coaching, please express your beliefs in a different thread.

You're right. Sorry about that.

I think the organzational structure is falling in line exactly as I expected it would and, as I've mentioned to you separately, I think VC is really putting his imprint on this franchise much more so than ever before.