mheisig
12-28-2007, 12:58 PM
I recently went on a two-day camping trip in the smoky mountains the weekend of December 15th. We had a group of six guys, all either friends or “friends of friends.” One of them was a guy I had never met before, a former Marine named Doug who had recently returned from Iraq. He’s dating the sister of a friend of mine, which is beside the point, but I had a chance to get to know him and pick his brain around the campfire one night for about three hours.
I thought I would share some of the observations that he shared with me, as I found them to be honest, insightful and completely lacking in political bias or agenda.
Just a little background on Doug: He was a Corporal in the 1st Marine Division (1st MarDiv) which was a part of the initial invasion of Iraq in 2003 along with the 3d U.S. Army Infantry Division. He was there on the front lines from day one, went into Baghdad and Tikrit, and was a part of the force that capture the Ramallah oil fields. As a Corporal, he led a machine gun detachment of (I believe) 7 or 8 men.
Our conversation took place over a flask of whiskey and a couple of good cigars, and I’ll try to highlight some of the more salient points he made throughout the evening, though it’s hard to fully replicate such a lengthy discussion. Additionally, Doug is not what I would call the “stereotypical Marine.” He’s just about done finishing his Bachelor’s of Science in Forestry management, is an avid outdoorsmen, guitar player, reader and scientist. He is knowledgeable on topics ranging from poetry to microbiology to Squad Automatic Weapons, and is incredibly articulate and thoughtful.
For starters, he is now against the war as it is currently being conducted, though he was for it when it first began. He said that during the initial invasion, the regular, active-duty military absolutely controlled the entire country. In a matter of weeks they completely swept the opposition and where in absolute control. He said that after Baghdad had been conquered it was incredibly peaceful, orderly and controlled. He believes that the real problems began when the active duty troops were removed and the national guard and reserves were brought in as a security force. He believes it’s at this point that things “went to hell.”
He is not against the war from a moral or ethical standpoint, but he has a great number of issues with the way the current occupation is being conducted. He is completely convinced that the insurgency could be quickly and easily eradicated if the regular army were allowed to do its job. He feels, essentially, that they have been hamstrung and aren’t allowed to operate the way they are capable of. He said that if the “gloves were taken off” and they could do what they were trained to do, the insurgency could be eliminated within days with little to no collateral damage.
He believes that the insurgency is allowed to continue because there is a tremendous amount of money to be made in the private sector. He mentioned Microsoft (of all companies) as a company he constantly saw operating in Iraq. His feeling is that the insurgency is allowed to continue because it’s incredibly profitable for the economy back home. It’s not a matter of not being ABLE to defeat the insurgency.
He also takes great issue with how the Marines provide for the troops, particularly with respect to body armor. They are currently issued large, cumbersome vests which are not terribly effective against the ubiquitous AK-47 (7.62x39mm rifle round). Apparently there is new body armor called DragonSkin which is far lighter, more flexible, and extremely effective against rifle rounds. It’s also somewhere around $9,000 per vest compared to the relatively inexpensive vests they are currently issued. He is extremely angry about the fact that a soldier’s life is simply not valued highly enough to warrant better armor.
Along these lines, he has a pretty low view of private contractors like Blackwater and Dyncorp, primarily because they are paid astronomically more than a U.S. soldier, and are all provided with DragonSkin and top-of-the-line equipment, all funded by U.S. government contract dollars in the billions. According to Doug, the contractors rarely did any of the “real” fighting, but ran around “playing soldier” with better gear and protection than the military would provide for its own troops. He doesn’t think the contractors are worthless, just that the money could be better spent on supplying the regular army and allowing them to do their job.
With respect to the “WMDs” he firmly believes that Saddam had them and moved them. He said that outside Baghdad is a man-made mountain about 4 miles long and hundreds of feet high, which is essentially a massive military warehouse. It is surrounded by four or five rings of fencing, and was infiltrated by a SEAL team supported by a detachment of Marines. He says he has seen numerous empty missle silos and equipment for moving large-scale missiles and warheads, but that the actual missiles themselves were nowhere to be found.
His most interesting insights were with respect to the media. He no longer watches television and despises CNN and Fox equally. His unit had both a Fox News and CNN reporter embedded with them at various times. He said they would go on a mission, fight a battle, and the next day they would watch the news report at their base and were astonished at the inaccuracies and flat out lies that were being told. He said the reporters seemed incapable of getting the slightest detail right about where they were, what they did, why they did it, and how they did it. He was adamant that virtually everything that comes across either network is nothing but propaganda based on the reality he experienced and what ended up being reported.
He also said that he saw both sides of the atrocities that are common to war. He said he saw Marines fire into crowds of unarmed civilians just because they could. He also saw Marines run directly into the line of fire to save civilians. Baghdad was apparently overjoyed when they entered, with throngs of people throwing flowers and cheering. He also said they learned to never turn their back on the crowds. He said that countless times the guy in front of you cheering, smiling and clapping would pull a weapon from underneath a cloak the minute you turned your back.
Our conversation eventually wandered off to talk of cigars, religion, politics and education. I found Doug’s perspective to be incredibly unique, as I had never had the chance to talk to an incredibly articulate and insightful guy who had also been on the frontlines from day one.
DISCLAIMER
Takes this all for what you will. The only level of truth that I can vouch for is that this is what Doug told me around a campfire one night. I have no reason to doubt him or suspect an agenda, as he comes down on both sides of the fence depending on which issue is being discussed. Perhaps the entire thing was a lie or massive stretch of the truth on his part, I have no way of knowing.
None of this is intended to be inflammatory or even spark debate. To be honest, if this does turn into a polarized debate, I hope the mods lock it don quickly. I merely pass it along as information. Read it, think it over, discard it, ignore it, do what you like.
My biggest caution would be to look at all this objectively and research things yourself, without trusting the media. I think all too often our entire worldview and “facts” are shaped entirely by the media. Whether you watch CNN, Fox, the BBC, NBC or any of the alphabet soup gang, take it all with a huge grain of salt and do your own research.
*UPDATE*
One important point I completely forgot to add with respect to oil. Doug was involved in the capture of the Ramallah oil fields, which apparently was one of the first targets after they went into Baghdad. He said he had no reason to think that they were there for the oil in particular, but that they were told that the goal was to avoid what happened in Kuwait in the first Gulf War. He said that as far as he knew, they were taking the oil fields as a strategic infrastructure target, just like electric plants, water, roads and airports.
I thought I would share some of the observations that he shared with me, as I found them to be honest, insightful and completely lacking in political bias or agenda.
Just a little background on Doug: He was a Corporal in the 1st Marine Division (1st MarDiv) which was a part of the initial invasion of Iraq in 2003 along with the 3d U.S. Army Infantry Division. He was there on the front lines from day one, went into Baghdad and Tikrit, and was a part of the force that capture the Ramallah oil fields. As a Corporal, he led a machine gun detachment of (I believe) 7 or 8 men.
Our conversation took place over a flask of whiskey and a couple of good cigars, and I’ll try to highlight some of the more salient points he made throughout the evening, though it’s hard to fully replicate such a lengthy discussion. Additionally, Doug is not what I would call the “stereotypical Marine.” He’s just about done finishing his Bachelor’s of Science in Forestry management, is an avid outdoorsmen, guitar player, reader and scientist. He is knowledgeable on topics ranging from poetry to microbiology to Squad Automatic Weapons, and is incredibly articulate and thoughtful.
For starters, he is now against the war as it is currently being conducted, though he was for it when it first began. He said that during the initial invasion, the regular, active-duty military absolutely controlled the entire country. In a matter of weeks they completely swept the opposition and where in absolute control. He said that after Baghdad had been conquered it was incredibly peaceful, orderly and controlled. He believes that the real problems began when the active duty troops were removed and the national guard and reserves were brought in as a security force. He believes it’s at this point that things “went to hell.”
He is not against the war from a moral or ethical standpoint, but he has a great number of issues with the way the current occupation is being conducted. He is completely convinced that the insurgency could be quickly and easily eradicated if the regular army were allowed to do its job. He feels, essentially, that they have been hamstrung and aren’t allowed to operate the way they are capable of. He said that if the “gloves were taken off” and they could do what they were trained to do, the insurgency could be eliminated within days with little to no collateral damage.
He believes that the insurgency is allowed to continue because there is a tremendous amount of money to be made in the private sector. He mentioned Microsoft (of all companies) as a company he constantly saw operating in Iraq. His feeling is that the insurgency is allowed to continue because it’s incredibly profitable for the economy back home. It’s not a matter of not being ABLE to defeat the insurgency.
He also takes great issue with how the Marines provide for the troops, particularly with respect to body armor. They are currently issued large, cumbersome vests which are not terribly effective against the ubiquitous AK-47 (7.62x39mm rifle round). Apparently there is new body armor called DragonSkin which is far lighter, more flexible, and extremely effective against rifle rounds. It’s also somewhere around $9,000 per vest compared to the relatively inexpensive vests they are currently issued. He is extremely angry about the fact that a soldier’s life is simply not valued highly enough to warrant better armor.
Along these lines, he has a pretty low view of private contractors like Blackwater and Dyncorp, primarily because they are paid astronomically more than a U.S. soldier, and are all provided with DragonSkin and top-of-the-line equipment, all funded by U.S. government contract dollars in the billions. According to Doug, the contractors rarely did any of the “real” fighting, but ran around “playing soldier” with better gear and protection than the military would provide for its own troops. He doesn’t think the contractors are worthless, just that the money could be better spent on supplying the regular army and allowing them to do their job.
With respect to the “WMDs” he firmly believes that Saddam had them and moved them. He said that outside Baghdad is a man-made mountain about 4 miles long and hundreds of feet high, which is essentially a massive military warehouse. It is surrounded by four or five rings of fencing, and was infiltrated by a SEAL team supported by a detachment of Marines. He says he has seen numerous empty missle silos and equipment for moving large-scale missiles and warheads, but that the actual missiles themselves were nowhere to be found.
His most interesting insights were with respect to the media. He no longer watches television and despises CNN and Fox equally. His unit had both a Fox News and CNN reporter embedded with them at various times. He said they would go on a mission, fight a battle, and the next day they would watch the news report at their base and were astonished at the inaccuracies and flat out lies that were being told. He said the reporters seemed incapable of getting the slightest detail right about where they were, what they did, why they did it, and how they did it. He was adamant that virtually everything that comes across either network is nothing but propaganda based on the reality he experienced and what ended up being reported.
He also said that he saw both sides of the atrocities that are common to war. He said he saw Marines fire into crowds of unarmed civilians just because they could. He also saw Marines run directly into the line of fire to save civilians. Baghdad was apparently overjoyed when they entered, with throngs of people throwing flowers and cheering. He also said they learned to never turn their back on the crowds. He said that countless times the guy in front of you cheering, smiling and clapping would pull a weapon from underneath a cloak the minute you turned your back.
Our conversation eventually wandered off to talk of cigars, religion, politics and education. I found Doug’s perspective to be incredibly unique, as I had never had the chance to talk to an incredibly articulate and insightful guy who had also been on the frontlines from day one.
DISCLAIMER
Takes this all for what you will. The only level of truth that I can vouch for is that this is what Doug told me around a campfire one night. I have no reason to doubt him or suspect an agenda, as he comes down on both sides of the fence depending on which issue is being discussed. Perhaps the entire thing was a lie or massive stretch of the truth on his part, I have no way of knowing.
None of this is intended to be inflammatory or even spark debate. To be honest, if this does turn into a polarized debate, I hope the mods lock it don quickly. I merely pass it along as information. Read it, think it over, discard it, ignore it, do what you like.
My biggest caution would be to look at all this objectively and research things yourself, without trusting the media. I think all too often our entire worldview and “facts” are shaped entirely by the media. Whether you watch CNN, Fox, the BBC, NBC or any of the alphabet soup gang, take it all with a huge grain of salt and do your own research.
*UPDATE*
One important point I completely forgot to add with respect to oil. Doug was involved in the capture of the Ramallah oil fields, which apparently was one of the first targets after they went into Baghdad. He said he had no reason to think that they were there for the oil in particular, but that they were told that the goal was to avoid what happened in Kuwait in the first Gulf War. He said that as far as he knew, they were taking the oil fields as a strategic infrastructure target, just like electric plants, water, roads and airports.