How Many Games Should Vick Be Suspended?

See post 87. And isn't that what Pacman got suspended for? He hasn't been found guilty of his latest crimes yet.

Charged is different than convicted. He's been CHARGED multiple times.

I'm not a Vick apologist, but I think that penalties levied by the team or the league need to be commensurate with the outcome of the charges. What if the league suspends him for a season or, as some have suggested, bans him for life and it turns out that the 'corrobrating witnesses' have fabricated or exaggerated their claims? Then what do you say, oops-sorry?

What if he truly owns the house but never visits and has no knowledge of what goes on there? Do I think that's the case? No, but I don't know for sure either way so I am not ready to exonerate or convict him until I hear the facts.

'Experts' have said that some of the items found on the property are items commonly owned by legitimate dog breeders. Without the bloody carpet, there probably would have been no reason to pursue the case, remember they went initially on a drug warrant and found no drugs but found the bloody carpet. Investigation of that led to the search that found the carcasses in the yard.

As I said, I'm not a Vick apologist and if guilty or plea I expect him to get prison time but the rush to punish without letting things run their course seems drastic.

Why the rush to suspend or ban him immediately before he has even set foot in a courtroom?

The dog fighting stuff is only the tip of the iceberg. The real crux of the issue is that it looks like this dog fighting is part of an interstate gambling ring. Thats the main reason the Feds are involved. The Feds are not the LA district attys office, they dont waste their time on maybe cases. This is a done deal. Vick is finished because I am 100% sure the cousin living at the house has flipped on Vick. He will be the one that tells the tale on the others (including Vick).

With Goodell's track record there's no way he can ignore an indictment from a federal grand jury. Vick's past behavior obviously becomes a factor as well. The way this is snowballing, there seems to be no way that MV will be on the field for the Falcons in the near future.

I assume that there are some trilateral (Goddell-Blank-Vick's Agent) discussions going on right now that will create an acceptable (financially) path toward an indefinite leave of absence for Vick.

That gives this drama some time to play itself out in the courts. IMHO Vick is toast -- the Fed's tend to not lose these cases, and a conviction will result in ample reason for a long term suspension (which may be the least of MV's problems at that point)
I ask again, what past behavior? When has he been charged with anything or even investigated in a CRIMINAL investigation?

Diffenence is that pacman was given times not to be out yet he still was out. He got introuble and was told not to do things but still did them and got introuble doing them. I would be fine if vick wasn't allowed to do things. NO being out past midnight. No more getting arrested. No going to the pet shop, whatever.

Ok, good point.

I still think a lot of people need to change their way of thinking, though, regarding how Vick has behaved in the past and that he was this squeaky-clean guy up until a few days ago. Just because he hadn't been caught doesn't mean he was a good guy who just made one mistake. Both guys are being accused of behaving badly for years, and neither has been convicted of their recent crimes (which led to a suspension for Pacman). But I hear you, Pacman was warned. Then again, did Vick really not know that this type of thing would lead to suspension by the league each time he allegedly committed these crimes over the past 6 years? I doubt it.

By the way, BSB....getting awefully close to that 5,000 post milestone.

The dog fighting stuff is only the tip of the iceberg. The real crux of the issue is that it looks like this dog fighting is part of an interstate gambling ring. Thats the main reason the Feds are involved. The Feds are not the LA district attys office, they dont waste their time on maybe cases. This is a done deal. Vick is finished because I am 100% sure the cousin living at the house has flipped on Vick. He will be the one that tells the tale on the others (including Vick).

I agree the Feds are involved because it is multi-state but how does that supercede the mantra 'innocent until proven guilty'? Anyone with common sense acknowledges that something doesn't smell right, but why the rush to punish NOW? He's going to get his, so why the mob mentality to (figuratively) lynch him immediately instead of when the trial has run it's course?

Until convicted, he shouldn't be suspended at all. He's innocent until proven guilty, so punishment shouldn't commence before a conviction. Judge Mountain Landis threw Joe Jackson out of baseball for life even though he was found innocent of charges in the Black Sox scandal. As far as I'm concerned, the Jackson punishment was grotesque, made in a particularly dark age, and was a lasting disgrace for Landis and a disgrace for baseball.

Nothing should happen to Vick until after a conviction. If he is convicted and serves his sentence, nothing should happen to him further. The commissioner's office should stay out of it, forever. Whether Atlanta wants Vick working for them now or after Vick serves a sentence should be entirely up to Atlanta.

If Vick is found quilty and and I were in charge in Atlanta, however, I would never take him back.

Charged is different than convicted. He's been CHARGED multiple times.

And Vick has been CHARGED with multiple counts of multiple instances of dog fighting over the past 6 years.

And Vick has been CHARGED with multiple counts of multiple instances of dog fighting over the past 6 years.

It's under one indictment, that is the major difference. He is not a 'repeat offender' because this is his first criminal charge.

Pacman has been ARRESTED numerous times. (per AP: Jones has not been convicted of a crime. He did, however, have 10 encounters with police and five arrests since he was drafted in 2005.) It's an established pattern of illegal behavior. He was warned numerous times by the NFL to stay out of trouble and those situations that breed trouble. He continued to put himself in those predicaments and was justly dealt with.

There is no correlation between Vick's and Pacman's situation.

I agree the Feds are involved because it is multi-state but how does that supercede the mantra 'innocent until proven guilty'? Anyone with common sense acknowledges that something doesn't smell right, but why the rush to punish NOW? He's going to get his, so why the mob mentality to (figuratively) lynch him immediately instead of when the trial has run it's course?

This is called discussion and speculation. Last time I checked thats the whole point of this board. If we used your logic there would be nothing to discuss, debate or speculate on because we would have to wait for things to run their course. If that was the case Matty could just shut down this site and we could all find something else to do.

I agree the Feds are involved because it is multi-state but how does that supercede the mantra 'innocent until proven guilty'? Anyone with common sense acknowledges that something doesn't smell right, but why the rush to punish NOW? He's going to get his, so why the mob mentality to (figuratively) lynch him immediately instead of when the trial has run it's course?

This thread is about guessing what Goodell is going to do. We're not talking about any court than Roger Goodell's. And, based on Goodell's track record (Henry, Johnson, et.al.) MV is likely to be suspended.

However, as I stated earlier, I feel certain that the league and owner will come to a "leave of absence" accomodation for MV. Like it or not, MV is a very public figure (by choice and with generous recompense) and the public court (you call it mob mentalitY) will have its say...