MTK
05-31-2007, 08:23 PM
Reid?
This thread just went to hell. :doh:
This thread just went to hell. :doh:
Belichick...Best of All Time????MTK 05-31-2007, 08:23 PM Reid? This thread just went to hell. :doh: skinsfan_nn 05-31-2007, 08:49 PM Reid? This thread just went to hell. :doh: Matty & SGG, this is the lost thread. How in the world you would with ANY logic rate reid at #4, that's just a JOKE! GIBBS #1 70Chip 06-01-2007, 12:55 AM Ask me after this year. Charlie Weiss may end up having been Belichek's Belichek. Or Gibbs could add another. And GTripp. Reid? How many conference finals has he lost at home? GTripp0012 06-01-2007, 02:27 AM GTripp, I don't know how you can elevate guys like Andy Reid above coaches like Joe Gibbs. 4th best coach of ALL TIME? I have all the respect in the world for Reid, but he doesn't hold a candle to Gibbs. To do what Gibbs did with so many different players is simply amazing.I guess thats where we differ. I think Gibbs does a very good job, to say the least, with player management, keeping his guys happy and all. But isn't that his job? There are better coaches, past and present than Joe Gibbs. We have enough of a sample on Reid to know that he does the little things like clock managment and delegating. But as I said before, the effect of coaching on overall performance accross the league is probably at its smallest effect in NFL history, so it's not really that big of a deal. GTripp0012 06-01-2007, 02:29 AM Matty & SGG, this is the lost thread. How in the world you would with ANY logic rate reid at #4, that's just a JOKE! GIBBS #1I think you are confusing the word "logic" with "blatent homerism". Not that theres anything wrong with that, so long as you realize that its not a serious evaluation of anything. GTripp0012 06-01-2007, 02:31 AM Ask me after this year. Charlie Weiss may end up having been Belichek's Belichek. Or Gibbs could add another. And GTripp. Reid? How many conference finals has he lost at home?Two. And I savored each one for weeks. Not sure how that detracts from Reid as a coach though. Unless you are claiming that he didn't have his guys ready or the like? 70Chip 06-01-2007, 02:53 AM Two. And I savored each one for weeks. Not sure how that detracts from Reid as a coach though. Unless you are claiming that he didn't have his guys ready or the like? Well it certainly doesn't add anything. Is it your position that the Eagles are a really average team and only his brilliant coaching took them that far? If you are at home you are favored to win so he basically got upset twice. So I guess I don't think he had his guys ready. Gibbs is about 7 and 1 in home playoff games. Sheriff Gonna Getcha 06-01-2007, 03:04 AM But as I said before, the effect of coaching on overall performance accross the league is probably at its smallest effect in NFL history, so it's not really that big of a deal. How can you say that? How can you say what "overall performance" would be without coaching, when every team is led by a coach? The league is full of examples is which coach A leads a team to a horrible record and is fired and coach B comes in and takes basically the same team and produces a winning team. And I still have no clue how Andy Reid (as good as he is) is put ahead of coaches like Bill Parcells and Joe Gibbs. GTripp0012 06-01-2007, 03:19 AM Well it certainly doesn't add anything. Is it your position that the Eagles are a really average team and only his brilliant coaching took them that far? If you are at home you are favored to win so he basically got upset twice. So I guess I don't think he had his guys ready. Gibbs is about 7 and 1 in home playoff games.I think 2002 Tampa Bay was better than 2002 Philadelphia. Can't say the same about 03 Carolina (to 03 Philly). But in any case, you are looking at a two game sample. Could be (and probably was) complete luck that the Eagles didn't win the NFC more than once in that era. Or it could be a combination of stiff competition and untimely whatever. On the whole, its only two games no matter how important they might have been. Not that I'm complaining or anything. :food-smil GTripp0012 06-01-2007, 03:38 AM How can you say that? How can you say what "overall performance" would be without coaching, when every team is led by a coach? The league is full of examples is which coach A leads a team to a horrible record and is fired and coach B comes in and takes basically the same team and produces a winning team. And I still have no clue how Andy Reid (as good as he is) is put ahead of coaches like Bill Parcells and Joe Gibbs.An educated guess based on years and years of data. If coaching was all there is to winning, the leagues's best coach would go 16-0 every season. So we can establish through common sense that coaching accounts for significantly less than the entire outcome of any given game. SGG, try looking at it this way: How often does a coach lose a game for his team? I mean, how often does a team come back to the locker room and say "we would have won that game (with 100% certainty) with 31 other coaches, but somehow we lost", and be accurate. I doubt this can be said in the last ten years. I reasonably estimate that 98% or more of a coaches in-game decisions would be ones that are complete no brainers, that is to say that every coach in the NFL would make the same call, the right call. The remaining 2% or the "questionable decisions" are what defines a coach's in game ability. However, if we theoretically assume that coach A will always make the correct questionable decision, and coach B will always make the worst questionable decision, how many wins will coach B cost his team over coach A? Put it this way: if you guessed one per season, I'd argue you are overestimating this effect. This is why I feel its somewhat pointless to second guess coaching decisions. While his in game performance suggests that he should be fired, coach B would still have won 60 games over the last 5 years if he coached the Colts. In the current game, Andy Reid and Bill Belichick would be my Coach A prototypes, and I'd say either Herman Edwards or John Fox might have been my type Bs. That part is just my opinion, but Edwards and Fox have both won in this league, no thanks to their in game coaching decisions. A coaches' offensive/defensive system is another slight variable, but the system is only going to be as good as the men who make it work. Every coach in the league has a system. Having a good system gives a slight advantage, but if you are facing Peyton Manning, you wont remember that advantage at the end of the 60 minutes. |
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