Jon Jansen's Comments on HGH

If someone in baseball, let's say Derek Jeter for example, said he estimated 15-20% of MLB players were on HGH that would be front page news everywhere. If we found that members of the Houston Astros team that lost the WS last year were found guilty of steroid use like the 2004 NFC Champion Panthers were just the other day that too would be front page news everywhere.

But unless names like Brady, Harrison, Reed are attached to HGH speculation. Or unless records are on the line, it won't ever be as big for NFL fans as it is for baseball fans

I think that's why it home to me personally, because most people don't know Jansen. But you're right, if it's not a big time player it just won't reverbarate on a national level.

Even in the last few decades, we've watched it whether we've realized it or not. When I was a kid, Fridge Perry was being talked about as huge, a 300-pound football player. It was almost unheard of, 300 pounds. Today, you can't play a line position UNLESS you're near or more than 300. It's not uncommon anymore, in fact, it's the standard now. Also, these 300-pounders today aren't fat like Perry, they're solid.

Look even further back to the backs and linemen of the 50s and 60s. They were the size of some of today's QBs and even punters. Now I haven't seen humans as a whole grow in size dramatically over the years (not talking about obesity, body frame sizes), so you have to think it's something that athletes are doing. Sure, technology in the weightroom has improved but you can still get big by old-fashioned free weights and hard work, so it's not the (only) real factor.

There's definately a problem. Have we as fans pushed it by wanting to see bigger and faster athletes? Yes. So has the ballooning salaries. It puts more pressure on them to avoid failure being more of a business than a game. The business world is ruthless, it's the survival of the fittest. Now that sports are businesses first and games second, the athletes have to get any edge they can or they'll be out of a job.

If someone in baseball said it, the union would come down on that player like a ton of bricks.

In the context that JJ is a long time veteran member of the team, the part that bothers me about the comment is that it suggests to me that the number applies to the Skins. My guess is that JJ has some strong feelings about playing and recovering within the rules while others are just doing whatever they can get away with.

More than performance enhancing, these drugs are recovery enhancing. To me, that is the big temptation. Being a bit stronger or faster is nice, but it has nowhere near the economic impact or game impact that it does if you get back on the field two games sooner than you would have otherwise. Recovery enhancement impact can mean the difference between 0% forever and 100% for five years.

Right now, I think there is very little intelligent discussion about these drugs. Everything is emotional. There are throw away lines about people being a "cheater". There is so much more to it than that.

There is also little discussion about the impact SOME of these drugs have. One impact is in the area of aggression. Another is in the area of sexual disfunction. But the big one is the unknown. What role did steroids play on Lyle Alzado dying of a brain tumor. Once again, we need more intelligent discussion and less emotional rhetoric (yeah I know, it is the age of the Internet, so what should I fucking expect).

All that being said, I'm not sure about a couple of things. First, I have VERY LITTLE confidence in the accuracy (on both positive and negative results) in terms of the testing. The confidence in testing for HGH is a gigantic question. In all likelyhood, the only people who could get caught for HGH are the stupid, overtalkative and the unlucky.

Second, I think there are circumstances where some of the substances that are banned should be allowed. For instance, there are many medically indicated use for a steroid for a large number of medical issues. How about cold meds? Should we really be screwing up careers and lives because someone wanted to deal with a nasty cold? If there is a treatment for an injury that is supervised by a real doctor and is safe (not perfectly, no drug is perfectly safe or without side effects), why should we ban those treatments?

HGH is not a steroid as has been aluded to. It occurs naturally in the body and goes up and down constantly. That is why there is no real conclusive test for it. Not to say it is better or worse but it is simply a performance enhancer.

You're right about the emotional approach to the discussion. I'm guilty of it too in baseball. I hate seeing a jerk like Barry Bonds put his name about the all-time greats in the record books by blantantly cheating and disrespecting the game. There IS some truth to the "cheater" allegations though.

I'm with you though, the affects of this behavior goes much further than just cheating. The physical problems it causes and the affects it has on the families of the drug users is real and it's horrible. I did a research paper on steroids way back in high school when it was looked at as an uncommon occurence. Also, when the standard is set that to suceed in pro sports, you have to use drugs in training, it will trickle down to college and high school kids who have aspirations to someday go pro.

HGH is not a steroid as has been aluded to. It occurs naturally in the body and goes up and down constantly. That is why there is no real conclusive test for it. Not to say it is better or worse but it is simply a performance enhancer.


True, it's not a synthetic drug like a steroid, but when you mess with the levels of any hormone in the body for reasons other than regulating it to a normal level for health reasons, the body will not handle it well and it will cause more harm than benefit.

What would happen if you decided to double the amount of, let's say stomach acid...uh oh. Look what happens when women increase their levels of testostersone...it not only makes them less of a woman, but it opens the door to medical conditions they would not have had otherwise.

If someone in baseball said it, the union would come down on that player like a ton of bricks.

In the context that JJ is a long time veteran member of the team, the part that bothers me about the comment is that it suggests to me that the number applies to the Skins. My guess is that JJ has some strong feelings about playing and recovering within the rules while others are just doing whatever they can get away with.

More than performance enhancing, these drugs are recovery enhancing. To me, that is the big temptation. Being a bit stronger or faster is nice, but it has nowhere near the economic impact or game impact that it does if you get back on the field two games sooner than you would have otherwise. Recovery enhancement impact can mean the difference between 0% forever and 100% for five years.

Right now, I think there is very little intelligent discussion about these drugs. Everything is emotional. There are throw away lines about people being a "cheater". There is so much more to it than that.

There is also little discussion about the impact SOME of these drugs have. One impact is in the area of aggression. Another is in the area of sexual disfunction. But the big one is the unknown. What role did steroids play on Lyle Alzado dying of a brain tumor. Once again, we need more intelligent discussion and less emotional rhetoric (yeah I know, it is the age of the Internet, so what should I fucking expect).

All that being said, I'm not sure about a couple of things. First, I have VERY LITTLE confidence in the accuracy (on both positive and negative results) in terms of the testing. The confidence in testing for HGH is a gigantic question. In all likelyhood, the only people who could get caught for HGH are the stupid, overtalkative and the unlucky.

Second, I think there are circumstances where some of the substances that are banned should be allowed. For instance, there are many medically indicated use for a steroid for a large number of medical issues. How about cold meds? Should we really be screwing up careers and lives because someone wanted to deal with a nasty cold? If there is a treatment for an injury that is supervised by a real doctor and is safe (not perfectly, no drug is perfectly safe or without side effects), why should we ban those treatments?


I think we can definitely open a huge can of worms by trying to address all the intelligent questions and arguments you just stated. But to do so at the expense of an extremely profitable enterprise, such as the NFL, and also the fact that they've managed to maintain a pretty clean image over the years is something they aren't in a rush to address.

I think what makes steriod use, or whatever the choice of enhancement, in baseball more of headliner is that one individual can instantly and consistantly change the outcome of the game and therefore a team's fortune. Whereas in football, you're always lining up 11 on 11, and the chances for one player to have such a great impact on the outcome of the game isn't as great.

I also think the focus on baseball is due to the magnitude of the records falling to "cheaters".

If Payton's rushing record was about to fall and Emmitt Smith had been a known steroid user (or HGH), not to mention a jerk like Bonds, there may have been the same hightened emotions and media frenzy.

True, it's not a synthetic drug like a steroid, but when you mess with the levels of any hormone in the body for reasons other than regulating it to a normal level for health reasons, the body will not handle it well and it will cause more harm than benefit.

What would happen if you decided to double the amount of, let's say stomach acid...uh oh. Look what happens when women increase their levels of testostersone...it not only makes them less of a woman, but it opens the door to medical conditions they would not have had otherwise.

I think you missed my point. It was simply that HGH is not a steroid. I did not mean to diminish the impact of its use. Just trying to educate a little.

15% to 20%? He's being very kind!

The bottom line is sports in general are flooded with HGH, and lets face the facts nobody wants them out, they produce a more intense and spectacular product, which produces more money for the powers that be.

Stiffer drug testing? Theres a laugh! Stiffer drug testing for something they can't detect, nor want to know about to begin with, please don't insult our intelligence!