Grade Rocky McIntosh

I think that Rocky Mc.intosh will be a great player if he can stay healthy, and not become injured. He should be able to make a great contribution to the Redskins linebacker core.

His a great player with huge potential that fills an area of need for your team with some health concerns that's the basics.

Philly hasn't won a SB but wen't to 4 consecutive championships games i nthe past 5 years tahts a championship caliber team... and tell me the last time Denver had a mediocare team you know a team that went 5 -11 like ours has thats a championship caliber team a team that's allways is competing and has a posibility to go for the superbowl.

Well, then that's your definition of "championship caliber". For me, I don't see any reason to pattern our franchise after a team like the Eagles when they've never won a super bowl, and when they've lost 3 out of 4 NFC championship games (two of which at their own stadium). The Broncos are lucky to make it out of the first round of the playoffs every year. To me, that's not "championship caliber". It might be "playoff caliber", but when you can't even make it to the AFC championship game, you're pretty darn far away from any kind of "championship".

so if teams like NE, Philly, Denver and Pittsburgh wich also use the same type of drafting li those 3 I previous mention aren't Championship caliber teams and models of succes tell me wich teams are? please let me know

Man i just gave names I didn'tput value on them of course they aren't worth a six.... just names to express a point.

Well the point that gets expressed by using Hall of Famers is that the skins somehow gave up 3 unbelievable players for just 1. That's not the case and it's disingenuous for you to now backtrack and not admit that your analogy was flawed. If you really only wanted to express your point with numbers, why not use hypotheticals like X, Y, Z? Particularly if you're going to use a baseball card analogy, the names of the players you choose are the only thing that governs the value of the cards (i.e. the picks).

so if teams like NE, Philly, Denver and Pittsburgh wich also use the same type of drafting like those 3 I previous mention aren't Championship caliber teams and models of succes tell me wich teams are? please let me know

so if teams like NE, Philly, Denver and Pittsburgh wich also use the same type of drafting li those 3 I previous mention aren't Championship caliber teams and models of succes tell me wich teams are? please let me know

Well, you didn't say Pittsburgh before, and I didn't argue against NE.

In any event, there isn't only one way to win a championship. Some teams have done it with amazing offense, some with great defense. Some with great drafting, some with key free agent acquisitions. Above all, however, I think the most important aspect is great coaching. You can have the best draft picks in the world, if your coaches suck, they aren't going to develop and your team is never going to be championship caliber. It's the coaching at NE and Pitt that made those teams great. I don't believe for one second that the same coaching staff couldn't have had the same success with key free agents.

I didn't say pitt because I tought 3 teams where enough but they also move up in the draft the same way Denver NE and the Eagles do they use the same type of strategy they don't give away future pics.

So you agree that NE and Pitts have great programs because they have won recent SB even though it took 10 years for pitt to reach the superbowl again, but you don't agree the Eagles and Denver have great programs championship caliber teams because the eagles didn't won the superbowl they played last year and lost 3 consecutive championship games.

And because denver hasn't win/gone to a superbowl since Elway that was 7 years ago even tought they have been consistent for the past 7 years and haven't had a bad season in all this time??

Moving up on the draft giving up future draft pics isn't innovating it has been done for ages and well history speeks for itself just tell me from the past 6 draft tell me all your first day pics how many are still on the team how many are probowlers or have lived to the spot they where drafted. How many are or will be busts you'll see a high percentage of players that didn't turn out to be what you plan that's why having more pics gives you a better chance 2 succed ( also selecting good players but thats another topic).

I agree Joe isn't afraid of innovating and yo usee it with the size and type of receivers his bringing this year but what his doing i nthe draft isn't innovating and has written dissaster all over the place we can talk about it in 4 years when gibbs is no longer in the team.

Gibbs is defining his own style of personnel decisions. Because of his style, nfl experts cannot evaluate the redskins draft on its own anymore, they must evaluate the entire offseason as a whole without separating any part of it (draft, free agency, trades, cuts, salary cap based decisions, coaching staff additions/changes). All of these areas of personnel decision-making affects each other as a whole. He is an innovator in these decisions, this approach, and (don't forget) the role and responsibilities he has set for himself as head coach and team president.

I don't want to talk about how he is doing when he is gone, that doesn't make any sense to me; let's discuss his ability and performance now. How he has improved the team and created stability with an openness to positive change. I will not forget the past decade or so without gibbs, and to me this is the best position the redskins have been in, in years. And the organization is still moving upward. To me, there is nothing to support that the draft for the redskins has disaster "written all over" it; and it seems to be just wishful thinking (and hating). Redskins last year: 10-6, playoff birth, won 6 games in a row (including playoff win)... and we have upgraded the team (especially in positions of need). I don't think that's a recipe for disaster.

I didn't say pitt because I tought 3 teams where enough but they also move up in the draft the same way Denver NE and the Eagles do they use the same type of strategy they don't give away future pics.

So you agree that NE and Pitts have great programs because they have won recent SB even though it took 10 years for pitt to reach the superbowl again, but you don't agree the Eagles and Denver have great programs championship caliber teams because the eagles didn't won the superbowl they played last year and lost 3 consecutive championship games.

And because denver hasn't win/gone to a superbowl since Elway that was 7 years ago even tought they have been consistent for the past 7 years and haven't had a bad season in all this time??

You said "championship caliber", not me. Explain to me how Denver is a championship caliber team. We're talking about current teams here, not what they did 10 years ago with completely different players and in many cases different coaching staffs. How is Denver "championship caliber"? Because they can get into the playoffs? Because they don't have bad years? Ok, so apparently they are awarding championships simply based on making the playoffs and consistency now? I wasn't aware of that.

As for the Eagles, the fact that they haven't won a super bowl is inexcusable. You're talking about a team that built itself up from the depths of the NFC, only to fall short year after year after year because they didn't want to spend the money to get themselves over the hump. And you want to model that franchise why? Because their system has yielded ONE NFC Championship in 25 years. Because their unwillingness to go after that one extra playmaker has arguably cost them 4 decent shots at a ring? How again are they "championship caliber"?

Look, I'm not going to argue semantics with you. You've (I think) explained why you believe these teams are championship caliber and why they support your stance that teams who trade future picks can't possibly ever win a championship. Being how the Skins are really the first team in recent memory to employ this strategy on a consistent basis, I think it's a little premature to say that their strategy hasn't worked.........especially since the team has made leaps and bounds since Gibbs has come back.

I will leave you with this, however. This offseason the Skins have added (through draft picks or otherwise) two legit #2 WRs who have already had success in the NFL, a pass rushing DE that will be a starter, a solid veteran starting TE, a solid veteran starting safety, a rookie LB that will probably be a starter, a backup QB with experience in a new explosive offense that has proven successful in the NFL, and an offensive coordinator thought by many to be one of the best in the NFL who could have been a head coach for other teams. All of that added to a team that went into the second round of the playoffs last year. What have Denver and Philly done to get better? Do the math and tell me the Skins don't appear to be in a better position at a championship run than those two "championship caliber" teams. Maybe their rookies are going to be great, maybe they'll be busts. At least we pretty much know what we got.

Gibbs is defining his own style of personnel decisions. Because of his style, nfl experts cannot evaluate the redskins draft on its own anymore, they must evaluate the entire offseason as a whole without separating any part of it (draft, free agency, trades, cuts, salary cap based decisions, coaching staff additions/changes). All of these areas of personnel decision-making affects each other as a whole. He is an innovator in these decisions, this approach, and (don't forget) the role and responsibilities he has set for himself as head coach and team president.

I don't want to talk about how he is doing when he is gone, that doesn't make any sense to me; let's discuss his ability and performance now. How he has improved the team and created stability with an openness to positive change. I will not forget the past decade or so without gibbs, and to me this is the best position the redskins have been in, in years. And the organization is still moving upward. To me, there is nothing to support that the draft for the redskins has disaster "written all over" it; and it seems to be just wishful thinking (and hating). Redskins last year: 10-6, playoff birth, won 6 games in a row (including playoff win)... and we have upgraded the team (especially in positions of need). I don't think that's a recipe for disaster.

In a nutshell DBOYS, WP has pretty much nailed it! I would add that you can take all the stats you wish, and you can apply that to the rank and fine with relative success, because most teams pretty much do the same thing as all the other teams lacking original any thought. That is not who you are talking about here. You can speculate as to the draft being a total disaster or whatever nonsense was being touted. I personally have to go with the creds..........who's got em'??????????? You..............Pine riders like like idiot Sean Salisbury.......or 3-time Super Bowl winning coach???? Easy choice.
Additionally, one of the X-players I do have respect for, as he has seen success, like Ron Jaworski, stated on interview when asked about things, draft "the Skins have had a fantastic off season". "The NFC East is scared to death with what they are doing in DC". You might be thinking.............the Boy's aint' afraid. They should be after the strummin' they had last season with Joe's team. Finally, If you need an avalanche of meaningless stats compiled by 20k a year drones, to give you a comfort zone, so be it! I'll go with results delivered! Joe goes his way and delivers! History always repeats itself!!!!!!!